hummm_mabbe Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 Hi Just wanted to see how much other can relate to this really I noticed the other day just what a hair-trigger invalidation still is for me. We all know about invalidation's central place in forming BPD thanks to Misses Martian Lineyham (yum), and I know it was something central in my life. When it comes up now, I try to use mindfulness with it - to notice the rage boiling inside. I also notice the impulse to either make the invalidating person feel ashamed of themselves, or to justify my pain to them in some way so that they will validate me. Both of these feel, and usually are, destined to failure, and I suddenly saw yesterday how fruitless following those automatic impulses in the past have been. After all, if someone has just invalidated you, its possible they are an invalidating person. They will treat your angry or exasperated reaction to them in the same way - and instead of changing their attitude, will just invalidate again! I end up stuck in a cycle with them, which may go some way to explaining why I always seem to get hopelessly embroiled with bullies. Even on here, as I type, i fear that my words will be invaidated by someone, and then I will feel enraged at them and have to debate how to react. At the mo, I can only be aware of the rage inside, and choose not to express it to the person (online I just ignore their post or comment), and instead go away and try to listen to the angry part of me and understand why he is so upset. Then I try to validate him. Its hard because there is a sense of "I should have given them what for", but I recognise that that all too often leads to more problems. But that does not mean that I should bury my anger away or pretend everything is fine to myself - by actually paying attention to it, and being with it, it feels a bit more healthy. Later on I know I can talk about it, to my T or to someone nice and validating. Its one thing to not show anger to others, and quite another to suppress and deny feelings within, and I know I suffer when i do this. I need to spend time acknowledging the feeling, otherwise that little hurt part of me just gets bigger and bigger and then I am hit with a wave of depression or an outburst of rage. You can only deny for so long ... Also, maybe accepting that this person might be invalidating, and to just "be with" that idea and not expect validation from them in the future, may go some way to avoiding becoming swept up with them. Just wanted to brain dump - invalidation sooo makes me wanna break stuff! Ross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walker Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 me too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villan Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 i am always scared of my replies being taken the wrong way sometimes i dont post cos of it typed word can be misinterpreted and i can understand all too well the feelings that "the wrong answer" can invoke... luckily i hate confrontation more than i feel the need to fight back so i try very very hard to jus ignore the comment... not easy... well done for recognising and coping with your feelings on this... big step... :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted September 3, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 Hi guys Yeah I think it might be an important step, because I realise how powerful the emotion is that comes over me. It may well be an important cog in maintaining the age old patterns I have lived out again and again. Hmmm thoughty thoughty think think Ross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walker Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 for me it is the big red nuclear button and i am on constant high alert to even the faintest breath of invalidation HOWEVER ashamed that i seem able to invalidate others with one tiny sweep of my tongue - and rarely even notice like an anaesthetic numbing what comes out but leaving vividly raw what is inside me confused did i say wrong thing - concerned now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxy222 Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 i have found it realy useful just to say straight to the person, dont invalidate me pls, or that is very invalidating of you etc etc. tends to stump them to have the truth just stated like that. and i feel both happy i have spoken up, and relieved iv not ripped them to shreds (which is what i used to do exceptionally well) i dont think not being angry at the person is the answer. it can feel very powerless to try and express that anger, to try and get the person to listen, cause your exactly right when you say that if a person is being invalidating theres a good chance thats who they are and they will not hear you, and we only hurt ourselves more when we bang our head of brick walls, but still it feels just as wrong, like a betrayal, to not say anything. i think the ability to say, no this is wrong calmly without the need to make the other person see and without the powerless feeling comes when we dont fear anger. the fear of anger, that all our strongest feelings will be overwhelming and be revealed and leave us vulnerable to yet more invalidation is why the impulse to hide it is so strong. i used to think that id just let it go cause who were they anyways, they have no idea who i am and they are clearly a joke and wouldnt even come close to having the capacity to understand, so i'll just ingore them, sweap them beneath my feet, leave them in their ignorance, but it didnt really help me feel any better. i think now often in these situations i now find it easier to express that they are being invalidating, which makes me feel so much better that i have stood up for myself, without being enraged, and i think being able to do that came from not fearing the rage, hell if anything now i feel thankful for it, releved my feelings can point out to me when people are harming me. i think also, although often people who are invalidating once can be like that allways this is not necessarily true for all. those of us who have experienced invalidation are often skilled at it ourselves, and can at times fall back on this as a defense mechanism, and well if someone non threateningly calls us on that it can be made easy to see how we are doing this, and how not too. and from the other point of view when we point this out we may find that actually some people who are willing to hear do actually hear us and take onboard what we are saying just because we say it, and that can be refreshing. oh i wanted to add, i think not worrying or caring or needing the correct response from them helps too. like being sure enough that our feelings are right that stating them is enough, not needing to proove that to the other person, just being able to say this is how it is and step back from it all helps too. sometimes you just have to say i am not about to go round in circles with you trying to explain something you are not willing to hear or do not have the capacity to understand, so i guess not fearing their response, so finding the validtaion or the oriegntation inside ourselves first rather than being relaint on needing anothers confirmation for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted September 3, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 Hi Roxy You are hitting the little nail on the head there This is kinna the roundabout of feelings and thoughts I have about it. There are so many variables, so many avenues, all of which are negative, that seem to come up when I think about this kind of thing, that it is paralysing. I have noticed that there are always two mutually opposed and equally powerful opposites inside of me that tend to neutralise each other, and lead to inaction. These are some of the things they say: "A: You have nothing to be upset about, you are over-reacting. B: But if they actually are being rude, you are being taken advantage of! Dont be a wimp, or people will always walk over you." "A: But you know you actually have a history of doing things to get peoples backs up - what if you are unknowingly doing that now? If you react with anger towards them, you will be shutting down their right to tell you that you're hurting or upsetting them and everyone will see you as someone who does not care. Then they really will have reason not to like you B: But what if Im not doing anything? I also have a history of being bullied - what if this person is a bully? " "A: Then you should just ignore them and they will go away B: Bullies never go away - silence just makes them try harder. You have to scare or frighten them so they leave you alone! And anyway, how am I supposed to know the difference? You tell me to ignore bullies, but I cannot tell the difference between them and someone who is being appropriately assertive, or even teasing in a friendly way, over something bad I am doing but am unaware of." I know that much of voice A is my mum, and the "you must be tough" is my dad. Theres a little bit of me in "B" as well. Unfortunately I never quite learned HOW to put their advice into practice, it was always given more as "you should just be more x, y and z and then you will be ok". Reading about invalidation online, one description of it is "minimising the impact of problems and making their solution seem easier than it is", and this I can very much relate to. I suppose my feelings are like being torn between whose advice to take, and lacking any clear instructions or belief to actually carry them out. Because taking action seems to almost always result in me feeling worse, it seems easier to do nothing, instead trying to validate my own anger. My fear is that "the group" will feel exactly as this invalidating person does, and that if I open my mouth, it will incur the anger of the group, and not just that one person. So it seems like damage limitation to just confine it to that one person by not feeding the issue and reacting. Also I know it is possible that I over-react - I just have no feel of when I am right to be angry, and when its an over-reaction. The simple way would be to just say "if I feel it, express it appropriately" - but then the A+B conversation above kicks in. Its interesting to hear that you always used to let rip with your anger - I have always felt that if only I could do that, it would be ok. Its interesting to hear that you felt it did not provide a solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted September 3, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 for me it is the big red nuclear button and i am on constant high alert to even the faintest breath of invalidation HOWEVER ashamed that i seem able to invalidate others with one tiny sweep of my tongue - and rarely even notice like an anaesthetic numbing what comes out but leaving vividly raw what is inside me confused did i say wrong thing - concerned now Hi Missie Walkie T You havent said anything bad I dont know if I invalidate, I guess I must. Prolly when I am feeling irritable or already angry or something, or someone presses a button. I used to be a member of a social anxiety site, and it was so negative and anti-recovery. When I read posts about social anxiety, I find I instantly feel angry or on edge before I have even really tried to get a feel of the person, so that would make me vulnerable to invalidate at that point. I try not to, but I guess I must do it occasionally. Ross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piuma Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 hey borris lol. just wanted to say yey me too. xx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villan Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 sorry to throw a big spanner into this but have been mulling it over and i think there is no right and wrong way to deal with this... i think that sometimes we see things too much as black and white and to gauge the most positive reaction to a situation will depend on many mnay variables... i did ramble on further with examples - but got lost in my explaination, hope you get what i mean just by the above... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted September 3, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 Lol chat world has leaked into serious world :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted September 3, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 sorry to throw a big spanner into this but have been mulling it over and i think there is no right and wrong way to deal with this... i think that sometimes we see things too much as black and white and to gauge the most positive reaction to a situation will depend on many mnay variables... i did ramble on further with examples - but got lost in my explaination, hope you get what i mean just by the above... Yup, each situ is different and on the face of it, it "should" just be as simple as that... prollem is, the compass is broken. Normal people "feel" their way through interactions, and tend to "just know" what the right approach is givne those multiple variables without thinking about it. For me, I cannot process those variables - there is only that sense of paralysis and fear, combined with the sense of anger and possible attack. It may seem that the answer is to "just" speak up, or "just" laugh it off - but then the same problem arises - what situation are you speaking up about, or laughing off? Is it really an invalidation, or is it an attack? Are you being belittled / dismissed, or simply misunderstood? Healthy people can FEEL this, I cannot which is why I havent "just" found the solution yet! (a barbed comment aimed at my past invalidators...) Its a bit like when people ask acrobats how they do a certain thing with their body. Their answer is that they "just" do it, because it is natural for them. Its hard for them to break it down into terms a non-expert can use because for them, its an automatic function of their bodies. Feeling your way through interactions (also called theory of mind) is something that many people with PD's do not have, I am such a person ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walker Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 am finding whole STEPPS therapy experience invalidating they say nice things - oh yes thats ok - we understand - blah blah but then they say distract, distance, balance to me i hear be quiet - stop making a fuss - stop being negative - get on with your life i HATE IT im not f*cking stupid - i KNOW how to be healthy - but it does not stop me hating me, or being a failure, or scared, or anxious, or angry or just plain bloody useless sorry to go off on one Ross - i seem to see invalidation in every breath, every crack in the road, every leaf on a tree, it is my constant companion and fear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxy222 Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 Hi Roxy You are hitting the little nail on the head there This is kinna the roundabout of feelings and thoughts I have about it. There are so many variables, so many avenues, all of which are negative, that seem to come up when I think about this kind of thing, that it is paralysing. I have noticed that there are always two mutually opposed and equally powerful opposites inside of me that tend to neutralise each other, and lead to inaction. These are some of the things they say: "A: You have nothing to be upset about, you are over-reacting. B: But if they actually are being rude, you are being taken advantage of! Dont be a wimp, or people will always walk over you." "A: But you know you actually have a history of doing things to get peoples backs up - what if you are unknowingly doing that now? If you react with anger towards them, you will be shutting down their right to tell you that you're hurting or upsetting them and everyone will see you as someone who does not care. Then they really will have reason not to like you B: But what if Im not doing anything? I also have a history of being bullied - what if this person is a bully? " "A: Then you should just ignore them and they will go away B: Bullies never go away - silence just makes them try harder. You have to scare or frighten them so they leave you alone! And anyway, how am I supposed to know the difference? You tell me to ignore bullies, but I cannot tell the difference between them and someone who is being appropriately assertive, or even teasing in a friendly way, over something bad I am doing but am unaware of." I know that much of voice A is my mum, and the "you must be tough" is my dad. Theres a little bit of me in "B" as well. Unfortunately I never quite learned HOW to put their advice into practice, it was always given more as "you should just be more x, y and z and then you will be ok". Reading about invalidation online, one description of it is "minimising the impact of problems and making their solution seem easier than it is", and this I can very much relate to. I suppose my feelings are like being torn between whose advice to take, and lacking any clear instructions or belief to actually carry them out. Because taking action seems to almost always result in me feeling worse, it seems easier to do nothing, instead trying to validate my own anger. My fear is that "the group" will feel exactly as this invalidating person does, and that if I open my mouth, it will incur the anger of the group, and not just that one person. So it seems like damage limitation to just confine it to that one person by not feeding the issue and reacting. Also I know it is possible that I over-react - I just have no feel of when I am right to be angry, and when its an over-reaction. The simple way would be to just say "if I feel it, express it appropriately" - but then the A+B conversation above kicks in. Its interesting to hear that you always used to let rip with your anger - I have always felt that if only I could do that, it would be ok. Its interesting to hear that you felt it did not provide a solution. when it is an over reaction it is a sign it belongs to the past, but that doesnt mean that the reason it is triggered in the here and now isnt a valid reason to be angry also, just that both need to be recognised for what they are and valued for that, one needs alot of slow time and the other needs heard now. theres lots of times i didnt react if i was angry, especially when much younger, or when i felt that i was 'over matched' by the person, but as a teenager i became very skillful at reading people and especially at finding their weaknesses and using them against them so subtley that they were defenseless, and immediately powerless, an exact replica of what t m did to me ofcourse. but now, mostly i think, i dont need to rely on either, althouhg ofcourse that slips too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villan Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 you are right... is why i deleted most of my previous response before postin it... i found i was quotin the "how normal ppls react" book rather than admit that i do exactly the same and feel outta control and powerless... guess my response did kinda lack empathy cos i was trying supress it... i also cant feel like "normal" people do... and that frustrates me no end... apologies if what i wrote before upset you... dint mean anything by it at all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted September 3, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 Hullo walkie person Yeah I know what you mean - it took me a long time to find a therapy that I did not find invalidating in that way. Not sure what to say, it may just be a function of how that therapy works. Only thing I can say is, tell them this is how you feel if you havent already. Otherwise it will just boil away and act as an invisible brake. Tell them you know they are trying to help, but it feels like they do not give time to how you actually feel, and instead presume that you can "just" take some action and have the feeling magically go away. Many therapy types do seem to assume this, especially CBT, which tends to think that you will either feel the change at the "rational alternative" level, or after repeating behavioural experiemtns until you can "see" the truth. For people with deeper emotional issues, there are an array of barriers to this, unique to the person. One such barrier is the type I have been taling about for myself - I know I have the right to stand up for myself. I know HOW to stand up for myself. I know that I am not a bad person who deserves to be punished. But yet when it comes to standing up for myself, the FEELING is that I cannot be sure if I have got an accurate assessment of what is happening - whether or not there is any need to assert myself, and if by doing so, it is going to cause problems. This is just a feeling that comes up, like a confusion and a panic. CBT cannot address these things, because it cannot define what situation im in. As Ninja said - each situ is different, and CBT is just rules. You cant always apply the same rigid rule to every situation, and so the rules fail if you cannot assess the situation accurately. Your own emotional barriers may be like this or different, you have to explore them. Ross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxy222 Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 sorry to throw a big spanner into this but have been mulling it over and i think there is no right and wrong way to deal with this... i think that sometimes we see things too much as black and white and to gauge the most positive reaction to a situation will depend on many mnay variables... i did ramble on further with examples - but got lost in my explaination, hope you get what i mean just by the above... Yup, each situ is different and on the face of it, it "should" just be as simple as that... prollem is, the compass is broken. Normal people "feel" their way through interactions, and tend to "just know" what the right approach is givne those multiple variables without thinking about it. For me, I cannot process those variables - there is only that sense of paralysis and fear, combined with the sense of anger and possible attack. It may seem that the answer is to "just" speak up, or "just" laugh it off - but then the same problem arises - what situation are you speaking up about, or laughing off? Is it really an invalidation, or is it an attack? Are you being belittled / dismissed, or simply misunderstood? Healthy people can FEEL this, I cannot which is why I havent "just" found the solution yet! (a barbed comment aimed at my past invalidators...) Its a bit like when people ask acrobats how they do a certain thing with their body. Their answer is that they "just" do it, because it is natural for them. Its hard for them to break it down into terms a non-expert can use because for them, its an automatic function of their bodies. Feeling your way through interactions (also called theory of mind) is something that many people with PD's do not have, I am such a person ... i dont think it is quite this simple for 'normals' either i see how my friends handel things like this and work colleges etc and most seem to have unhealthy patterns, for atleast some of the time. some people ofcourse handle these things well in general but i think for the most part they are few and far between and its something that alot of people either struggle with on a long term basis to some extent, or something they deny and allways react badly too - hense the reason alot of these patterns get passed along generations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted September 3, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 you are right... is why i deleted most of my previous response before postin it... i found i was quotin the "how normal ppls react" book rather than admit that i do exactly the same and feel outta control and powerless... guess my response did kinda lack empathy cos i was trying supress it... i also cant feel like "normal" people do... and that frustrates me no end... apologies if what i wrote before upset you... dint mean anything by it at all... I was feeling a bit frustrated, yes! But I know you were tryin to help. I guess this is a case in point - if I hadnt already known you, then I would prolly have got very very angry, but cos I know you and that you are nice, I had to think that mabbe it was something else. Its hard though, because I can never really be sure. I wanted to just wait and see what happened instead of reacting to your posts. I suppose this is a case in point - I DID feel invalidated by what you said, and I did feel angry. If I had just let you know at that point, you maybe would have got upset, or it may have started one of those 6 page fights we often get on here, and I would not have been trying to understand really where you were coming from. I guess by hanging back a little bit, or just letting my irritation leak out a little, you saw that i was getting irritated and said sorry, and hopefully thats a good thing because I know you didnt mean it badly and you know Im not deeply pissed at you. Of course, now Im worried that, as a result of me saying that, you are upset and dont like me! Lol .... poooo. I guess thats what Im scared of - that Ive made a mistake and it will make me lose a friend, or be rejected / ostracised. Ross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxy222 Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 am finding whole STEPPS therapy experience invalidating they say nice things - oh yes thats ok - we understand - blah blah but then they say distract, distance, balance to me i hear be quiet - stop making a fuss - stop being negative - get on with your life i HATE IT im not f*cking stupid - i KNOW how to be healthy - but it does not stop me hating me, or being a failure, or scared, or anxious, or angry or just plain bloody useless sorry to go off on one Ross - i seem to see invalidation in every breath, every crack in the road, every leaf on a tree, it is my constant companion and fear when we have been victims of invalidation we are vulnerable to being constatly triggered by it. important thing is both realities are true, we are over reacting because it has triggered past feelings, but also that the present day trigger itself is invalidation if they 'understood' like the say then they wouldnt make useless suggestions. im not the worlds biggest fan of distraction techniques, they have their place admittedly, but emotions dont react well to manipulation, and will come back with vengence. using distraction for an evening to keep yourself safe until help at say the t appointment in the morning makes perfect sence, but distraction for a life time, never going to help sorry these people are so uselessxxxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted September 3, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 i dont think it is quite this simple for 'normals' either i see how my friends handel things like this and work colleges etc and most seem to have unhealthy patterns, for atleast some of the time. some people ofcourse handle these things well in general but i think for the most part they are few and far between and its something that alot of people either struggle with on a long term basis to some extent, or something they deny and allways react badly too - hense the reason alot of these patterns get passed along generations. Agreed! :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted September 3, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 when we have been victims of invalidation we are vulnerable to being constatly triggered by it. important thing is both realities are true, we are over reacting because it has triggered past feelings, but also that the present day trigger itself is invalidation if they 'understood' like the say then they wouldnt make useless suggestions. im not the worlds biggest fan of distraction techniques, they have their place admittedly, but emotions dont react well to manipulation, and will come back with vengence. using distraction for an evening to keep yourself safe until help at say the t appointment in the morning makes perfect sence, but distraction for a life time, never going to help sorry these people are so uselessxxxx Lol did we both buy our hymn sheet in the same shop? Couldnt agree more ... My body actually physcially reacts when I try to 'manipulate' an emotion - I feel my throat tighten up and my guts contract. Ross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxy222 Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 you are right... is why i deleted most of my previous response before postin it... i found i was quotin the "how normal ppls react" book rather than admit that i do exactly the same and feel outta control and powerless... guess my response did kinda lack empathy cos i was trying supress it... i also cant feel like "normal" people do... and that frustrates me no end... apologies if what i wrote before upset you... dint mean anything by it at all... I was feeling a bit frustrated, yes! But I know you were tryin to help. I guess this is a case in point - if I hadnt already known you, then I would prolly have got very very angry, but cos I know you and that you are nice, I had to think that mabbe it was something else. Its hard though, because I can never really be sure. I wanted to just wait and see what happened instead of reacting to your posts. I suppose this is a case in point - I DID feel invalidated by what you said, and I did feel angry. If I had just let you know at that point, you maybe would have got upset, or it may have started one of those 6 page fights we often get on here, and I would not have been trying to understand really where you were coming from. I guess by hanging back a little bit, or just letting my irritation leak out a little, you saw that i was getting irritated and said sorry, and hopefully thats a good thing because I know you didnt mean it badly and you know Im not deeply pissed at you. Of course, now Im worried that, as a result of me saying that, you are upset and dont like me! Lol .... poooo. I guess thats what Im scared of - that Ive made a mistake and it will make me lose a friend, or be rejected / ostracised. Ross there is a difference as well between telling someone they 'are invalidating' (or they are rude or are patronising or are ignorant) and telling them what they say comes accross that way, or that what they have written is invalidating, or that by there word choice they are being hurtful, in general not just with regard to this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walker Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 But yet when it comes to standing up for myself, the FEELING is that I cannot be sure if I have got an accurate assessment of what is happening - whether or not there is any need to assert myself, and if by doing so, it is going to cause problems. This is just a feeling that comes up, like a confusion and a panic. yes except i am crap at standing up for myself - as i seem to respond like a young angry child - not what people expect when they see a middle aged woman. I will cry or swear or say something which i am told is innapropriate i just lose myself in that moment - control - GONE - then instantly grabbed back so they dont see occasionally i have responded with control, adult, insight, but could prob count those times on one hand - they often stick in my head as its like i am actually playing the part of a grown up. mostly - like you - i bury it, let it burn inside, let the hurt get as far as my mouth and swallow it down ed - its sad cos stepps team think they are being validating - try hard i can see - but YES roxy - their attitude is that skills must be learnt - for life i have tried to point out to them that at 45 - i have used many of these skills for years - but they solve nothing - just prolong the agony and invalidate my NEED to have my negativity validated they just say and do what i have been taught for decades by my mum - dont make a fuss, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted September 3, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 "when we have been victims of invalidation we are vulnerable to being constatly triggered by it. important thing is both realities are true, we are over reacting because it has triggered past feelings, but also that the present day trigger itself is invalidation". Yes this makes sense. I know about the past infrigning on the present, but I think I may have taken that too far and was effectively saying "because I know this feeling is from the past, therefore the feeling in the present canot be real", which is wrong. If I had never had those past experiences, there would still be SOME feeling, but not the amount that I do feel. It may be easier to deal with that smaller feeling, if it came along on its lonesome. Therapy has been a lot about dealing with this invalidation - I think the sticking point is that I was SO invalidated that sometimes part of me argues that I was ever invalidated! Lol .... "You werent invalidated, you were just always oversensitive!". Talk about vicious circles ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villan Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 returns to earlier response bout not wanting to post here cos typed word gets misunderstood and u cant explain straight away... and i hate that what i am trying to say doesnt come across like i want it to. glad you could see behind your interpretation of what i wrote, through to the person behind the words and thank you for calling me nice... of course now i am reading and reading your reply and noticing things like you are not "deeply" pissed with me - implying that yuo are in some way "pissed" with me... BUT that is MY insecurity showing through and probably not what you meant either... I think i will go back to just huggin and agreeing... at least for a while... o and for the record - i still like you and i'll look out that thing to send you when i get home... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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