Joshua Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 I think its important what the rules state in this respect. having the urge to harm and seeking support is ok wishing to seek help to prevent harm is ok telling people on the forum you have and details of this is not ok. Each of us have our limits but not all of us are able to observe these. The rules exist to keep everyone safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Sounds like a great friend! But we cant do more here then that either,encourage to seek help,so why do you feel your current self harm needs to be mentioned for that? What does it add for you thats needed? Lilly It's about not feeling like you have to watch what you're saying. Also, if it's about OD'ing for instance, you can be given practical advice on ways to reduce what you're taking, or reducing the damage. Or even have it pointed out to you that you've gone too far with it to a point where it's no longer a positive risk and becomes a 'need to go get help' situation, and be encouraged to do that. To me, that is real, practical help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 It's about not feeling like you have to watch what you're saying. Also, if it's about OD'ing for instance, you can be given practical advice on ways to reduce what you're taking, or reducing the damage. Or even have it pointed out to you that you've gone too far with it to a point where it's no longer a positive risk and becomes a 'need to go get help' situation, and be encouraged to do that. To me, that is real, practical help. Okay, I understand. Lets say though this exact situation occours. You take an overdose, you wish for the practical support of someone telling you to go get help. Next what happends is your admitted under section for weeks or even worse end up dieing. The last person to speak to you was a member from this forum. How could they deal with that? And believe me this is a real risk as its happened... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustbinbabe Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 I think some people on here have short term memory loss cos it was not that long ago a valued member of this community was going through a hard time and made a status that was quite triggering about SH and yet people were desperate to erase the sight of it rather than reach out a hand of support. PIUMA IS A REALLY GOOD PERSON AND NOT THE BAD GUY FOR EXPRESSING AN OPINION PLUS SHE'S UBER SUPPORTIVE AND UNDERSTANDING :masked: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 I have told a certain friend who understands these things, that I have OD'd and they have encouraged me and supported me to go and get approrpriate help for it. Something I wouldn't have felt able to do on my own. Its real great that on the occasion you refer to your friend was able to help you out and encourage you. The thing is should your friend suffer with the same issues you do, who is having a particually hard day that day and is feeling pretty emotionally down - would they be able to offer the same support to you then? Many people who suffer with mental health issues are good at putting others needs before their own but i think we all know this isnt great for our health. Then don't go into the crisis section then! I know I have to avoid watching Casualty, Police programmes, get triggered by ambulances etc. I know the things I need to avoid when I'm feeling really vulnerable, and it's up to me to do that, nobody else. If I am gonna be triggered by trying to help someone, it's my responsibility to step back and let someone who is in a place to help that person in crisis, give them the help they desperately need. The person in crisis should be the priority. Those who are safer, need to practice taking some responsibility for not putting themselves in situations they can't cope with. For the person in crisis, they have gone past the point of being able to think rationally and take responsibility, at that particular moment. That's why it's called a crisis. My friend does suffer similar MH issues to me, and we are honest with each other and say when we can't cope with talking about certain stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily-Bee Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 And what do you think about what Joshua says,that we need to protect other members who might not be having the best day and could be worse off for trying to handle it? If you view it as a way of protecting other sensitive people who might not always realize their limits,does that make it more reasonable to you? Lilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily-Bee Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Not everybody has enough insight (yet) to know what they need to avoid or feel very compelled to help members they feel are friends when really they shouldnt in light of their own problems. Lilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saharah Blue Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Part of learning support its learning how to ask for help, learning how to receive it, and learning how to give it. It is that dynamic that I believe is important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 It's about not feeling like you have to watch what you're saying. Also, if it's about OD'ing for instance, you can be given practical advice on ways to reduce what you're taking, or reducing the damage. Or even have it pointed out to you that you've gone too far with it to a point where it's no longer a positive risk and becomes a 'need to go get help' situation, and be encouraged to do that. To me, that is real, practical help. Okay, I understand. Lets say though this exact situation occours. You take an overdose, you wish for the practical support of someone telling you to go get help. Next what happends is your admitted under section for weeks or even worse end up dieing. The last person to speak to you was a member from this forum. How could they deal with that? And believe me this is a real risk as its happened... I understand what you're saying, but people can disappear and people can worry, whether or not we've talked about SH/OD or not. To me, saying you're in crisis and really struggling is worrying enough, whether or not specific details are mentioned, if someone disappears. Also, I think it can be encouraging when people come back after a crisis, to be able to give feedback on how support has helped and what they learnt from what they went through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Then don't go into the crisis section then! I know I have to avoid watching Casualty, Police programmes, get triggered by ambulances etc. I know the things I need to avoid when I'm feeling really vulnerable, and it's up to me to do that, nobody else. If I am gonna be triggered by trying to help someone, it's my responsibility to step back and let someone who is in a place to help that person in crisis, give them the help they desperately need. The person in crisis should be the priority. Those who are safer, need to practice taking some responsibility for not putting themselves in situations they can't cope with. For the person in crisis, they have gone past the point of being able to think rationally and take responsibility, at that particular moment. That's why it's called a crisis. Its interesting to me that you should put the needs of someone who is in crisis before the needs of others. This isnt a triage situation, we all have needs and feelings all of the time and I dont believe its for any one of us to say whose needs are more important at one time or another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christine001 Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 I for one will never discuss sh on this forum again. because its not safe and because I have to think of others before my own needs ( a rule I Learnt as a child and validated here), as I know this started when I posted on status I haven't said anything yet. I do agree that saying stuff on updates is wrong and did apologies. I also think the evidence that there aren't enough of us on here to support people currently suicidal I think that is a bit thin,as I have seen many people get instant support if they post.Yes I know some people cant deal with it feel helpless or get triggered, maybe there should be a notice about how to respond or not if you feel someone is in imminent danger, which would be more reassuring rather that the current rule. There seems to be an assumption that people have help and support, can pick up a phone etc, well in my case thats not true, nor do I have any strategies, so IT that cant be named will continue, unhealthy as has been described. anyway rules are rules and this is,as I have found and experienced a dictatorship and not worth trying to change as you are wasting your time, The whole subject of a topic for sh has been suggested before and I think they had one once and stopped it, so I tale the rough with the smooth on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 And what do you think about what Joshua says,that we need to protect other members who might not be having the best day and could be worse off for trying to handle it? If you view it as a way of protecting other sensitive people who might not always realize their limits,does that make it more reasonable to you? Lilly No, quite frankly, because I think the person who is in real crisis needs the help more at that particular moment that someone who is yet in a place to realise their limits. Of course I care about protecting sensitive people, but if there were two people that needed helping, I would choose to try and help the one who was in crisis first every time. And if you're that sensitive, avoid the forum until you feel stronger. That's what I call taking responsibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 No, quite frankly, because I think the person who is in real crisis needs the help more at that particular moment that someone who is yet in a place to realise their limits. Of course I care about protecting sensitive people, but if there were two people that needed helping, I would choose to try and help the one who was in crisis first every time. And if you're that sensitive, avoid the forum until you feel stronger. That's what I call taking responsibility You would apply this logic to someone who is not in crisis but not to the person that is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Then don't go into the crisis section then! I know I have to avoid watching Casualty, Police programmes, get triggered by ambulances etc. I know the things I need to avoid when I'm feeling really vulnerable, and it's up to me to do that, nobody else. If I am gonna be triggered by trying to help someone, it's my responsibility to step back and let someone who is in a place to help that person in crisis, give them the help they desperately need. The person in crisis should be the priority. Those who are safer, need to practice taking some responsibility for not putting themselves in situations they can't cope with. For the person in crisis, they have gone past the point of being able to think rationally and take responsibility, at that particular moment. That's why it's called a crisis. Its interesting to me that you should put the needs of someone who is in crisis before the needs of others. This isnt a triage situation, we all have needs and feelings all of the time and I dont believe its for any one of us to say whose needs are more important at one time or another. If putting someone's needs who are in crisis above somebody else's helps to save their life, then I am not going to apologise for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 If putting someone's needs who are in crisis above somebody else's helps to save their life, then I am not going to apologise for that. Its not for another to 'save' your life. In these situations the only person who can truly save your life is you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily-Bee Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 People can always post in the crisis section that they are in crisis,I think if people post theyre in crisis help comes from many members,what is the added bonus of mentioning current SH I wonder? We cant from behind our screens administer any kind of real help,all we can do is get really worried. Lilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christine001 Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 I alway love it when I amignored bye bye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 No, quite frankly, because I think the person who is in real crisis needs the help more at that particular moment that someone who is yet in a place to realise their limits. Of course I care about protecting sensitive people, but if there were two people that needed helping, I would choose to try and help the one who was in crisis first every time. And if you're that sensitive, avoid the forum until you feel stronger. That's what I call taking responsibility. You would apply this logic to someone who is not in crisis but not to the person that is? Yes, because the whole point of having a crisis section is to try and offer help and support in times of CRISIS!! It doesn't need censoring, and shouldn't be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 If putting someone's needs who are in crisis above somebody else's helps to save their life, then I am not going to apologise for that. Its not for another to 'save' your life. In these situations the only person who can truly save your life is you. Then why the f**k have we got MH professionals? They are there to help and guide us and to encourage us to be able to do that for ourselves. We need help to do that sometimes, and I would say that posting in crisis is a way of asking for that help when we can't get it elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily-Bee Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 So a crisis means all rules are no longer valid as in a crisis all is allowed? Lilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 People can always post in the crisis section that they are in crisis,I think if people post theyre in crisis help comes from many members,what is the added bonus of mentioning current SH I wonder? We cant from behind our screens administer any kind of real help,all we can do is get really worried. Lilly But we can administer real help!!! My life was at risk the other day and I had support from someone on the telephone, for 6+ hrs, and that helped to save my life. He wasn't their in person to physically stop me, but he accompanied me until I felt strong enough to go home. I've already said why mentioning current SH helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Then why the f**k have we got MH professionals? They are there to help and guide us and to encourage us to be able to do that for ourselves. We need help to do that sometimes, and I would say that posting in crisis is a way of asking for that help when we can't get it elsewhere. Yes they are there to enable you, motivate you and support you. The keyword in all of that is you because ultimately change comes from within. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily-Bee Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Were not MH proffessionals though,were peers........do we put the kind of responcibility MH proffessionals have on members? Lilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 So a crisis means all rules are no longer valid as in a crisis all is allowed? Lilly YES!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustbinbabe Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 I SEE YOU CHRISTINE CAN SOMEONE MOVE THIS TOPIC TO A BETTER SUITED AREA PLEASEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE WITH A CHERRY ON TOP!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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