So Called Former Borderlines Are Really Full Of Bs

[icu_baby]

Yes, in the UK we get free healthcare and it is a blessing in some ways. In others it isn't. I didn't receive any proper psyche input until a few years ago (I am now aged 34 and took first overdose aged 16 been sh since I was about 7). So although we have the "care" he we often don't receive it and are left out in the dark, alone and scared for many, many years. Only this weekend I called the "crisis" team who didn't know anything or offer me anything although I was suicidal and having sh visions etc... and going into a psychotic kind of place. And as I have two children all through holidays (and summer is 6 weeks) I cannot access support centre or therapy as I can't take them with me. Sometimes friends can have them or my partner can have a day off but apart from that I am basically abandonded during any school holidays or if the children are sick. Apparently you are not allowed young children if you have mental health issues. So many times they have had to wait in the mh waiting room with toys and books whilst my husband and I desperately try and attend my psychiatrist reviews.

The only thing that keeps me going is the hope that it can be different. The "power of intent" is very powerful and central to most religious/recovery type things. AA (or an "anonymous" organisation) follow the prayer or mantra don't they. The one about knowing what is the right path and god granting them the power to know which is the right one etc.... so that is why so many of us defend hope so vehemently. I don't know if you can read this or if you have blocked me now.

Hey hun, sorry you are going through such a tough time atm. PM me I am here for you.

[foreverborderline]

I wrote a long, well thought out, nicely worded reply.

Then I gave up.

I've tried here, but now I feel that you're abusing the service.

Well, I feel you are wrong. If you wanna give up then just do it. How am I abusing the service by being WHO I AM ? I am doing my best, what just because I feel that people who say they are cured from BPD are not be truthful and are damaging others by giving false hope I am abusing the service ? OK whatever.

[icu_baby]

I think people need to realize that foreverborderline is in a country where if you are poor you cannot get access to treatment.

Those of you in the UK can get treatment if you are poor and that is where the difference lies.

Not to nitpick, but the difference is that 'not having access to treatment' is not the same as 'BPD being incurable'. It may be effectively incurable as the result of no treatment, but coming back to the OP, the fact that forever has no access to treatment does not logically mean that anyone who says they recovered from BPD must be a fake.

So whilst its important to have sympathy for his condition, its worth seeing why people have reacted critically. Perhaps if he had spoken of the hopelessness of his situation and vented his anger about it, rather than projecting that anger onto others such as Josh and making them a target, this thread may have panned out differently. I think people would have had a great deal more time and sympathy.

Ross

Dear Ross,

I don't think that he meant to project his anger at anyone (I think he is just venting). I think he genuinely feels that he cannot be helped ross. I do have sympathy for his situation.

When I was extremely sick I was labelled with BPD and told that I was that was what I had and not to "not contact us again" (meaning the hospital) after a serious serious life-threatening overdose. I was left to my own devises about what this condition meant and I searched the internet and wrongly got information that it is incurable (and of course it is curable and I believe it is). I read in my medical notes that said and I quote directly: "she has bpd and is unmodifiable". I was furious of course at this suggestion.

There are a lot of stupid, ignorant psychiatric registrars out there that are ill informed about this condition and that we can and are deserving of treatment and can be helped. Forever has been misinformed by the wrong people. I am (that is if I ever did have bpd, I have now been dx with bipolar) living proof that you can get better. I am lucky enough to have two wonderful pdocs that have helped me whereas forever is still stuck in a situation where he has absolutely no support and thus is disillusioned that people with bpd can be helped. He is obviously wrong, what he has learnt in medical school is out of date and I feel that I need to give him hope and tell him that he can get better instead of attacking him.

[CrippleAndStarfish]

You actually sound like my ex. Not a good thing, in case you were wondering.

BPD, nahh, i don't think it can be CURED.

But it can sure as hell be RECOVERED from. Doesn't mean it's gone.

BPD is typically all-consuming - whether that's because you're on a downward spiral of self-destruction and everything has gone to shit and you're falling to pieces, or whether it's the frantic efforts of making yourself 'perfect' for whoever you're with, whatever situation you're in, keeping that mask of 'hey, mannn! Yeah, i'm fine!' firmly in place every second of every day.

To recover from BPD, in my opinion, is to not have these thoughts plaguing you constantly, to not be exibiting the symptoms that scream 'BORDERLINE!!!' at you from the pages of the dsm iv.

To recover is to ACCEPT that this is a complicated illness, and there are a lot of tangles to be, well, untangled.. so we can get a good look at what is actually there before we even begin to try to change the not so productive/positive/healthy aspects of our thoughts/behaviours.

To recover is to realise that we may never have a completely 'normal' life (for example, we may have hightened emotional reactions to things that others wouldn't even blink at), but to accept that as part of who we are as a person, and to keep working on the things we can change.

For me - that is self-harming behaviour. I have little control over how tearful i get over pretty much everything, but one thing that i am very good at controlling is my urges to self-harm, drink excessively, over-dose, or walk in traffic.

That's not to say that i don't still get these urges, strongly!, when i am feeling distressed. But in my general life, they do not occur, whereas 2 years ago, i was doing some sort of destructive behaviour every day, because i just did not have the self control.

Now that is just an absolutely miniscule example, but it is still a big step on MY path ro recovery. And y'know, if theres one thing i am, it's persistent. I believe i can recover - I believe EVERYONE can recover, and goddammit i'm going to!

My ex used to tell me all the time that BPD is there for good. You can't get better from it. Even went so far as to say that us 'Borderlines' were sent here to earth to enable those 'nons' to learn and grow spiritually. No consideration for the fact that WE are living through hell too, just simply telling me over and over 'you're not gunna get better, so there's no point even trying'.

I'm sorry you are feeling the pain and distress that you are, but it is not fair to say that those who have recovered are bullshitting us, giving false hope, or whatever.

Even though we all have been diagnosed with BPD, we are still of course individual people, with our own fears, difficulties, pasts, and hopes for the future. Not all of us are the same.

I think the scariest part of facing recovery, and knowing that it IS possible, is the completely overwhelming feeling of how much time, pateince, and hard work it is going to take us once we have seen just exactly what is going on inside us that makes us act/think/feel the way we do.

That's why you gotta take it one step at a time. Even if it's just 'getting through the day', then the next day doing the same again. That is still coping, and all the time we learn new ways to make things a little easier for us, another tiny shuffle of the feet along that yella' brick road of recovery.

I've well and truly gone off on one now. I'm in a very strange mood, and this has got me thinking about some things i would have much rather forgotten, but not to worry.

I wish you the best.

[foreverborderline]

You actually sound like my ex. Not a good thing, in case you were wondering.

BPD, nahh, i don't think it can be CURED.

But it can sure as hell be RECOVERED from. Doesn't mean it's gone.

BPD is typically all-consuming - whether that's because you're on a downward spiral of self-destruction and everything has gone to shit and you're falling to pieces, or whether it's the frantic efforts of making yourself 'perfect' for whoever you're with, whatever situation you're in, keeping that mask of 'hey, mannn! Yeah, i'm fine!' firmly in place every second of every day.

To recover from BPD, in my opinion, is to not have these thoughts plaguing you constantly, to not be exibiting the symptoms that scream 'BORDERLINE!!!' at you from the pages of the dsm iv.

To recover is to ACCEPT that this is a complicated illness, and there are a lot of tangles to be, well, untangled.. so we can get a good look at what is actually there before we even begin to try to change the not so productive/positive/healthy aspects of our thoughts/behaviours.

To recover is to realise that we may never have a completely 'normal' life (for example, we may have hightened emotional reactions to things that others wouldn't even blink at), but to accept that as part of who we are as a person, and to keep working on the things we can change.

For me - that is self-harming behaviour. I have little control over how tearful i get over pretty much everything, but one thing that i am very good at controlling is my urges to self-harm, drink excessively, over-dose, or walk in traffic.

That's not to say that i don't still get these urges, strongly!, when i am feeling distressed. But in my general life, they do not occur, whereas 2 years ago, i was doing some sort of destructive behaviour every day, because i just did not have the self control.

Now that is just an absolutely miniscule example, but it is still a big step on MY path ro recovery. And y'know, if theres one thing i am, it's persistent. I believe i can recover - I believe EVERYONE can recover, and goddammit i'm going to!

My ex used to tell me all the time that BPD is there for good. You can't get better from it. Even went so far as to say that us 'Borderlines' were sent here to earth to enable those 'nons' to learn and grow spiritually. No consideration for the fact that WE are living through hell too, just simply telling me over and over 'you're not gunna get better, so there's no point even trying'.

I'm sorry you are feeling the pain and distress that you are, but it is not fair to say that those who have recovered are bullshitting us, giving false hope, or whatever.

Even though we all have been diagnosed with BPD, we are still of course individual people, with our own fears, difficulties, pasts, and hopes for the future. Not all of us are the same.

I think the scariest part of facing recovery, and knowing that it IS possible, is the completely overwhelming feeling of how much time, pateince, and hard work it is going to take us once we have seen just exactly what is going on inside us that makes us act/think/feel the way we do.

That's why you gotta take it one step at a time. Even if it's just 'getting through the day', then the next day doing the same again. That is still coping, and all the time we learn new ways to make things a little easier for us, another tiny shuffle of the feet along that yella' brick road of recovery.

I've well and truly gone off on one now. I'm in a very strange mood, and this has got me thinking about some things i would have much rather forgotten, but not to worry.

I wish you the best.

Well, anytime someone says I sound like someone else it IS a good thing for me because anytime I can escape who I am then that is good. Very well thought out post you made here, you do make some good points. I guess maybe it is a little unfair of me to say that we all are one and not individuals. I guess for myself I feel that I AM BPD , not that I HAVE BPD. I do not feel a person but instead I feel a diagnosis. If you or anyone else feels that they can recover then by all means go ahead and do so and I wish you or them the very best. My point here was whenever people say 'I have recovered" it is VERY,VERY dangerous, because the status quo of the MH community still tells people (at least in the U.S. they do) that BPD cannot be cured, or even 'recovered" from, that we are always 'recovering" and never fully will be recovered. I think it shows people that some recover and some do not and that of course hurts.

Put it this way, if you had friends and they all were getting better while you were getting worse would you not feel hopeless ?

Let me just put this out there, I think that Joshua,or A.J. or anyone else who claims they no longer are Borderlines are in fact still BPDers but for some reason it makes them feel better to say they are CURED ... if that makes them feel better then great they should TELL THEMSELVES that , but what I have a problem with is telling the WORLD that they are cured when all the medical literature says this is a disorder that is incurable. Dangerous stuff I tell ya. VERY dangerous.

[foreverborderline]

Thanks Icu_baby for not attacking me, everyone else feels it is their anti depressant (to attack me)

[icu_baby]

Thanks Icu_baby for not attacking me, everyone else feels it is their anti depressant (to attack me)

Forever, thats ok but I wish you could realize that you can recover from BPD. Maybe you are in a depressed state right now and can't see it because you feel helpless and hopeless and they are all signs that you are very depressed so you see everything as black. There is plenty of literature out there that suggests that you can recover and live a happy and fulfilling life. You have been talking to the wrong people way too long.

[foreverborderline]

Thanks Icu_baby for not attacking me, everyone else feels it is their anti depressant (to attack me)

Forever, thats ok but I wish you could realize that you can recover from BPD. Maybe you are in a depressed state right now and can't see it because you feel helpless and hopeless and they are all signs that you are very depressed so you see everything as black. There is plenty of literature out there that suggests that you can recover and live a happy and fulfilling life. You have been talking to the wrong people way too long.

Well, It appears that BPD may be curable but only people who do not have substance issues ,other PDs, and other issues such as Bipolar or depression that go along with the BPD can possibly be cured. Maybe those people who have so called been cured did not have any other issues which complicate the disorder. What my last P doc said was BPD only gets better with consistent care and treatment and

the people that they see getting better are people who are not addicts or alcoholics, or have other mental health problems, cases like mine are complicated as I have a boatload of issues and no real treatment. My mindset is what keeps me sick. I truly feel in my mind that I cannot get better. I hope others can and for those that have I am jealous but truly am happy for them.

My mother was Borderline but she was misdiagnosed for many years as manic depressive, I see that she was Borderline for sure. It is unfortunate that insurance companies here in the U.S. won't treat many people that have BPD and many doctors will not and the reason for this is not only in my view but the general conscientious in North America is that this disorder cannot be cured, so nobody really wants us. DBT treatment is not covered by many insurance companies here in the U.S. as it is not deemed as necessary. DBT is very pricey and thus the reason why I remain stuck in my screwed up thinking.

[icu_baby]

DBT is an excellent treatment for BPD but there is CBT which is also good for bpd. DBT is not the only one. Can you not try and do another form of therapy? Also, concentrate on beating your drug addiction and getting help for your bipolar. Do one step at a time and then work on your BPD. I believe with small steps you can do it forever.

[foreverborderline]

OK Icu_baby, I am trying to find help for my drug addiction, actually trying to find a doctor and therapist as well but no luck yet. Navigating the free services is really tricky, especially in this economy, every rehab I have wrote to or called refers me somewhere else as they tell me they are private only and have no free care. I need help for it all and all at the same time because in my experience in the past , when I treat the addiction and not the MH issues then I do not get better , it is necessary to treat them all at the same time. I have not used or drank in 5 days and I am lying here crying,pulling my hair out, and shaking as I need to use so badly. Withdrawal sucks big time.

[icu_baby]

I wish I could help you but I am on the other side of the world. Keep trying to access those services, there is hope, I know its hard but there is. Write to oprah or Dr Phil even.

[foreverborderline]

Thanks, my wife wrote to Intervention and they cannot help, we wrote to Dr Phil, Oprah, etc and no response but thanks.

[angelsmile]

You actually sound like my ex. Not a good thing, in case you were wondering.

BPD, nahh, i don't think it can be CURED.

But it can sure as hell be RECOVERED from. Doesn't mean it's gone.

BPD is typically all-consuming - whether that's because you're on a downward spiral of self-destruction and everything has gone to shit and you're falling to pieces, or whether it's the frantic efforts of making yourself 'perfect' for whoever you're with, whatever situation you're in, keeping that mask of 'hey, mannn! Yeah, i'm fine!' firmly in place every second of every day.

To recover from BPD, in my opinion, is to not have these thoughts plaguing you constantly, to not be exibiting the symptoms that scream 'BORDERLINE!!!' at you from the pages of the dsm iv.

To recover is to ACCEPT that this is a complicated illness, and there are a lot of tangles to be, well, untangled.. so we can get a good look at what is actually there before we even begin to try to change the not so productive/positive/healthy aspects of our thoughts/behaviours.

To recover is to realise that we may never have a completely 'normal' life (for example, we may have hightened emotional reactions to things that others wouldn't even blink at), but to accept that as part of who we are as a person, and to keep working on the things we can change.

For me - that is self-harming behaviour. I have little control over how tearful i get over pretty much everything, but one thing that i am very good at controlling is my urges to self-harm, drink excessively, over-dose, or walk in traffic.

That's not to say that i don't still get these urges, strongly!, when i am feeling distressed. But in my general life, they do not occur, whereas 2 years ago, i was doing some sort of destructive behaviour every day, because i just did not have the self control.

Now that is just an absolutely miniscule example, but it is still a big step on MY path ro recovery. And y'know, if theres one thing i am, it's persistent. I believe i can recover - I believe EVERYONE can recover, and goddammit i'm going to!

My ex used to tell me all the time that BPD is there for good. You can't get better from it. Even went so far as to say that us 'Borderlines' were sent here to earth to enable those 'nons' to learn and grow spiritually. No consideration for the fact that WE are living through hell too, just simply telling me over and over 'you're not gunna get better, so there's no point even trying'.

I'm sorry you are feeling the pain and distress that you are, but it is not fair to say that those who have recovered are bullshitting us, giving false hope, or whatever.

Even though we all have been diagnosed with BPD, we are still of course individual people, with our own fears, difficulties, pasts, and hopes for the future. Not all of us are the same.

I think the scariest part of facing recovery, and knowing that it IS possible, is the completely overwhelming feeling of how much time, pateince, and hard work it is going to take us once we have seen just exactly what is going on inside us that makes us act/think/feel the way we do.

That's why you gotta take it one step at a time. Even if it's just 'getting through the day', then the next day doing the same again. That is still coping, and all the time we learn new ways to make things a little easier for us, another tiny shuffle of the feet along that yella' brick road of recovery.

I've well and truly gone off on one now. I'm in a very strange mood, and this has got me thinking about some things i would have much rather forgotten, but not to worry.

I wish you the best.

I LOVE YOUR POST THANKYOU XXXXXXX

[foreverborderline]

Why thank you Angel :)

[hummm_mabbe]

I never said that people were fakes, WHAT I SAID was that nobody can lose their BPD diagnosis, it just is not possible

Well, not exactly. What you said was "So called former borderlines are really full of BS". I can tell this is what you said, because its emblazoned in 1cm high white lettering across the top of my screen.

Ross

[foreverborderline]

I never said that people were fakes, WHAT I SAID was that nobody can lose their BPD diagnosis, it just is not possible

Well, not exactly. What you said was "So called former borderlines are really full of BS". I can tell this is what you said, because its emblazoned in 1cm high white lettering across the top of my screen.

Ross

Well, that could be taken in many ways. But you are right, when people say that they no longer have bpd I do not think they are telling the truth, or someone lied to them. Maybe they have got better some but they still have the disorder. They just manage it better now, but they still have it as there is no cure, remember ?

[icu_baby]

I have bipolar disorder and there is no cure for bipolar disorder but it can be managed and symptoms can go into remission even though i may have some residue symptoms left over.

[foreverborderline]

I have bipolar disorder and there is no cure for bipolar disorder but it can be managed and symptoms can go into remission even though i may have some residue symptoms left over.

Exactly, finally someone that agrees with me.

[icu_baby]

I have bipolar disorder and there is no cure for bipolar disorder but it can be managed and symptoms can go into remission even though i may have some residue symptoms left over.

Exactly, finally someone that agrees with me.

Hun I am talking about bipolar disorder and not borderline personality disorder.

[hummm_mabbe]

Well, that could be taken in many ways. But you are right, when people say that they no longer have bpd I do not think they are telling the truth, or someone lied to them. Maybe they have got better some but they still have the disorder. They just manage it better now, but they still have it as there is no cure, remember ?

I dont 'remember' BPD being incurable - I remember you insisting that it must be because your psych's told you that. Yes, they are qualified - but so are all the other psychiatrists and psychologists that disagree with them.

OK this is going nowhere. I believe, that you believe, BPD is incurable. I think thats the closest we are going to get to agreement.

Ross

[icu_baby]

Well, that could be taken in many ways. But you are right, when people say that they no longer have bpd I do not think they are telling the truth, or someone lied to them. Maybe they have got better some but they still have the disorder. They just manage it better now, but they still have it as there is no cure, remember ?

I dont 'remember' BPD being incurable - I remember you insisting that it must be because your psych's told you that. Yes, they are qualified - but so are all the other psychiatrists and psychologists that disagree with them.

OK this is going nowhere. I believe, that you believe, BPD is incurable. I think thats the closest we are going to get to agreement.

Ross

Can I just say ross too that there are may "qualified" psych registrars coming out of uni being told a lot of garbage that bpd is incurable in Australia. You are right just because they are doctors doesn't mean they know shit all.

[notawallflower]

Well, that could be taken in many ways. But you are right, when people say that they no longer have bpd I do not think they are telling the truth, or someone lied to them. Maybe they have got better some but they still have the disorder. They just manage it better now, but they still have it as there is no cure, remember ?

I dont 'remember' BPD being incurable - I remember you insisting that it must be because your psych's told you that. Yes, they are qualified - but so are all the other psychiatrists and psychologists that disagree with them.

OK this is going nowhere. I believe, that you believe, BPD is incurable. I think thats the closest we are going to get to agreement.

Ross

LOL!!!!! Ross how in god's name can you stand it around here?

[Roses]

I was wondering the same thing myself wallflower. This thread makes me want to bang my head on a wall!

[Joshua]

Anyway, I do not see any hope for me but I will continue to post my feelings on BPDWORLD. The point of all of this was not to knock anyone down or knock down their hope, I do hope people can get better and will. The point of all this was my anger at people who say they no longer have BPD when I know from my studies in pre med school that BPD cannot be cured, it never goes away, you don't lose the diagnosis and the people who say they have RECOVERED from BPD are not right, they may have gotten better but they still BPD, once you have it you have it for life , read anything on the disorder from an actual doctor and it will say exactly that. Don't hate me , it is pure medical fact that this disorder cannot be cured.

I no longer hold the diagnosis it was removed....

[foreverborderline]

I was wondering the same thing myself wallflower. This thread makes me want to bang my head on a wall!

Then start banging darling !!!! B)