Why Is There Stigma Surrounding Bpd?

[Elke]

The stigma for people with BPD is so bad that when you initially step into your (Dr.'s, Therapist's, Caseworker's, Nurse Practitioner's) office, they are waiting for you to "step out of line." Their "guns are already drawn and they are ready to fire.

I never saw it that way. It explains a lot of the (in my opinion irrational) behavior from therapists and in hospital stays. Often been overly "accused" for things like "pushing past the receptionist" when the receptionist "let me pass". Or taking a rest and accidentally falling asleep and missed picking up my night medication. Accused of doing it intentionally.

I am on a forum for Benzo withdrawal. After a while I wrote that I had BPD. Up until then I got a lot of support. One time I was in crisis, took a few Benzos more but wrote that I was going back to my taper. In their eyes I did "step out of line" and they did "start to fire" told me I wasn´t supposed to be on a forum for withdrawal, if I "continually took masses of Benzos when in crisis". It was just one day then I went right back on taper. But what a daylong, endless scene and drama!

Also want to add that there are many movies on T.V. about the "bad, evil" Borderliners and its the human race that watches these movies. No wonder there is stigma. And yes, I too have often wondered why Psychs come up with this diagnosis and then seem to refuse to want to cure it.

Elke

[Elke]

There is even an "in group stigma". I mean that Borderliners can stigmatize each other. I had a friend who was Borderliner and he threw a "lot" of accusations at me about certain traits and I of often felt he was prejudice whereas if he hadnt known I was BPD he probably never would have done this.

[icu_baby]

Its sad because the acid hoax lady who threw acid on her face and said that a stranger did that too her has been labelled as having borderline personality disorder now.

[Jinxsta]

Its sad because the acid hoax lady who threw acid on her face and said that a stranger did that too her has been labelled as having borderline personality disorder now.

OH MY!... "self-harm, must be BPD".

xxx

[icu_baby]

Its sad because the acid hoax lady who threw acid on her face and said that a stranger did that too her has been labelled as having borderline personality disorder now.

OH MY!... "self-harm, must be BPD".

xxx

Exactly, its so simplistic to make self-harm as synonymous BPD

[hummm_mabbe]

There is even an "in group stigma". I mean that Borderliners can stigmatize each other. I had a friend who was Borderliner and he threw a "lot" of accusations at me about certain traits and I of often felt he was prejudice whereas if he hadnt known I was BPD he probably never would have done this.

I think that is called 'projection'. We hate seeing in others the things we dislike, or feel others reject, about us.

[hummm_mabbe]

Its sad because the acid hoax lady who threw acid on her face and said that a stranger did that too her has been labelled as having borderline personality disorder now.

OH MY!... "self-harm, must be BPD".

xxx

Exactly, its so simplistic to make self-harm as synonymous BPD

Its a weird one isnt it. I was told by my therapist that within the NHS when she worked there, SH and angry outbursts were considered 'hallmarks' of BPD. I pointed out that they are ony two of the criteria, and she said that generally, stereotypes do exist.

I was reading a weighty text about the study of personality and personality disorder, and one of the authors in there said that PD diagnoses are "necessarily vague and fuzzy", so I guess trying to navigate such a deliberately imprecise terrain means that people fall back on rules of thumb. Its not a good thing, but I can see why it happens.

Ross

[lewchocolate]

I went from PTSD/Depression to BPD and the change in the way people (health care people) treat me is completely different. They don't want me to take medications, I had to fight my way to maybe getting a psychologist and its always about what have I done to myself every time I see my doctor or key worker. I feel like I am being "managed" rather than "treated" which really pi**es me off. Last year I was told that I could not see a psychologist because it was not long term therapy which is what I need for BPD but I know speaking to my advocate that the PTSD label people don't have to fight to get to see a psychologist at all. I have never felt at any point from being treated as a child to now being treated as an adult that there is any worse label than BPD put on me or have my distress so easily dismissed. People on this forum know how difficult it is to live with BPD (or what we want to call it because its our right to label ourselves) but to have professionals dismissing your distress and pain due to a stupid label makes me so angry! DBT is meant to be the magic therapy for BPD but 8 out of 10 people find it pointless, distressing and not helpful. No BPD then no DBT, you get CAT or CBT both from what I have read and having had CBT for eating disorder helps so much. These are the treatments BPD label removes us from and that is wrong!

[fluxy1990]

I totally agree in my opinion i think 'emotionally unstable personality disorder' which is also a nicer way to put it when people dont understand. I havent told my mates yet, but i think if i say that maybe they will understand more? i havent seen my mates since july . Hope everyones well xxx

[icu_baby]

I went from PTSD/Depression to BPD and the change in the way people (health care people) treat me is completely different. They don't want me to take medications, I had to fight my way to maybe getting a psychologist and its always about what have I done to myself every time I see my doctor or key worker. I feel like I am being "managed" rather than "treated" which really pi**es me off. Last year I was told that I could not see a psychologist because it was not long term therapy which is what I need for BPD but I know speaking to my advocate that the PTSD label people don't have to fight to get to see a psychologist at all. I have never felt at any point from being treated as a child to now being treated as an adult that there is any worse label than BPD put on me or have my distress so easily dismissed. People on this forum know how difficult it is to live with BPD (or what we want to call it because its our right to label ourselves) but to have professionals dismissing your distress and pain due to a stupid label makes me so angry! DBT is meant to be the magic therapy for BPD but 8 out of 10 people find it pointless, distressing and not helpful. No BPD then no DBT, you get CAT or CBT both from what I have read and having had CBT for eating disorder helps so much. These are the treatments BPD label removes us from and that is wrong!

Hi chocolate, where did you get the8 out of 10 people find DBT to be distressing rather than not helpful. I am doing DBT and think the same but I am the only one in my group that thinks its not as helpful as it makes out to be. Everyone else in my group loves it.

[lewchocolate]

ICU Baby I got it from an academic journal which was one of the numbers they used. Plus when people say its an effective treatment this comes from comparing "normal care" or nothing in terms of talking treatment than other types of therapy (medications excluded). When DBT is compared to CBT/CAT its there is no evidence to suggest that DBT offers any benefit or is more effective than other therapies. That is what I read in the journals.

[lewchocolate]

ICU Baby I got it from an academic journal which was one of the numbers they used. Plus when people say its an effective treatment this comes from comparing "normal care" or nothing in terms of talking treatment than other types of therapy (medications excluded). When DBT is compared to CBT/CAT its there is no evidence to suggest that DBT offers any benefit or is more effective than other therapies. That is what I read in the journals.

[icu_baby]

ICU Baby I got it from an academic journal which was one of the numbers they used. Plus when people say its an effective treatment this comes from comparing "normal care" or nothing in terms of talking treatment than other types of therapy (medications excluded). When DBT is compared to CBT/CAT its there is no evidence to suggest that DBT offers any benefit or is more effective than other therapies. That is what I read in the journals.

Hey Chocolate, do you mind posting this journal up on here as an attachment so I can download it and show it to my psychologist?

So DBT is only effective in terms of the fact that some people get some attention as apposed to no attention at all? Is that right?

cheers

[lewchocolate]

I will find some articles on monday when I am back at uni But yes DBT is better than TAU (nothing extra) but is not more effective than other forms of therapy like cognitive behavioural/analytical therapy.

[sanctuary]

Stigma is when a stereotype sticks to the name.... There is a stigma attached to single mums, indian people, gay people, and BPD because the minority seem to stick in the memories of most.

A small amount of people give the rest of the population a bad name. That goes for all stigmas. Best we can do is re-educate rather than castigate.

xx

[lewchocolate]

Either I will get in trouble or people will hate me. Posted a study that compared all the treatments including DBT, please note this is a psychological paper and its not a easy read. Plus it leaves out more complex CBT and CAT.

http://rapidshare.com/files/421700995/sdarticle.pdf

[icu_baby]

Either I will get in trouble or people will hate me. Posted a study that compared all the treatments including DBT, please note this is a psychological paper and its not a easy read. Plus it leaves out more complex CBT and CAT.

http://rapidshare.com/files/421700995/sdarticle.pdf

Thanks so much Chocolate, this is fantastic.

[jennyflake]

I wonder if part of the stigma is due to a complete lack of awareness. As it says on the site to get onto this 'many professionals have not received training in how to work with those diagnosed with personality disorders'.

[hummm_mabbe]

I think a big part of it als has to do with how most modern therapies work, and as a result, how medics are trained in them.

Therapies like CBT make certain presumptions about any patient, and one of the key ones is about the "therapeutic alliance". This basically refers to how easily the patient can become "allied" with the therapist to work against the negative inner and outer patterns in the persons life. Normally, a therapist would expect, as a helper, to be felt to be on the same side as the patient, a role they perhaps value highly as most therapists tend to be very 'other-centred' and like helping others.

With personality disorders however, this breaks down. Especially in BPD, NPD and Paranoid Personality Disorder, the ability to form a trusting bond, and so an alliance, is far more difficult. The patient will tend to see the therapist in the same ways as they see the world - as critical, attacking, rejecting or abusive, or in the case of NPD - as a source of Narcissistic gratification. A 'normal' alliance is extremely hard to form, and actually often needs to become the FOCUS of therapy - that is, working with the person's mistrust and perceptions of the therapist as (for example) critical and rejecting, or judgmental, until a point is reached where basic trust is established. For some this can take more than a year, especially if the person's ability to trust is badly damaged.

For medics and therapists unused to this very different set of challenges, their OWN issues can get triggered in what is called "counter-transference". The patients reactions trigger the therapists own hot buttons, which of course re-triggers the patient. So therapists that work with PD's need to have their own "stuff" well under control, and in fact a great many therapists either havent had this degree of experience, or have not worked through their own sensitivities. Especially when faced with extremely angry, apparently critical, perhaps guilting behaviour from a patient, the therapists own feelings of being controlled, dominated, perhaps even of shutting down to cope with an onslaught like that, means they often end up feeling burnt out and unsure how to progress. Such therapists really should not be treating personality disorders, and especially you can see that 'lower-level' workers are even less likely to have gone through the necessary emotional conditioning to know how to handle PD's.

As always, knowledge is power - and once people are shown and helped to deal with the unique challenges that PD's present, usually there is a huge improvement in the therapeutic relationship. That is why often people find their therapist becomes much easier to be around when PD is diagnosed, because they now recognise that a very different approach is needed.

Therapies that include working with "transference" tend to fare better here, as they will understand that the same issues that plague the person in their life, will also come into the therapy room. This is actually a good thing because it gives them a chance to work directly with the most upsetting and debilitating aspects of PD directly, and therapies such as psychoanalysis, psychodynamic therapy, mentalisation, client centred counselling and schema therapy all use the therapy relationship as a means of recovery.

Ross

[Alaska_Grown]

I understand that everyone is different, and everyone sees EVERYTHING differently than the next person... but for ME the stigma around BPD is because of the lack of awareness (like some have already said.) If someone doesn't know all the facts about BPD, they're just going to go off of what they DO know and not even comprehend what they do NOT know. Specifically with me, yes, I seek attention at times, others I don't want to be bothered with. I have very black and white thinking, I get very depressed and I get very happy. I get manipulative at times and I have got a VERY short fuse and drag out conflict. I start fights for no apparent reason and then go back as if I never did anything wrong. Okay... BUT I have got the BIGGEST heart that I know of... I will help EVERYONE before I help myself... I have a big passion for children with disabilities, ADORE artwork and photography and will use all my skills in all of those to help whoever I can. So you look at me and say "Okay, she's got BPD... BUT, what else does she have?" Yes, BPD is a terrible thing to have in my mind... BUT IT IS ME AND I CANNOT CHANGE IT. Just because those stigmas and idiots who are not aware of the COMPLETE diagnoses of BPD does not mean that this diagnosis is THAT simple and easy to deal with... Sorry for the ramble.. but I got a bit fired up! back to the coffee!

[lewchocolate]

To be completely honest even though I have the "BPD" label and I have read up on it, I still don't understand it. I understand parts but other parts just make no sense to me. So if I can't completely understand it can other people? Say my recent overdose which I planned for 6 weeks in order to know what and how I should do it, even booked time off work. That was seen by my doctor as an impulsive act even though I knew that I was going to do it and I did inform them many times exactly what I was going to take. To me that is not just a natural progression I got to the point where I could not cope any more and then did it. I am just saying its bloody difficult to know what is BPD and what is me if that makes sense. I might be talking non-sense but it's not easy. I just think that its just a stupid label that means nothing.

[Alaska_Grown]

Like I said, EVERYTHING means something different to EVERYONE... that includes BPD... The doctor... is just that, a doctor. He was not the "founder" of BPD, he has just read up on it and can tell you what HE knows. As for the "impulsive" behavior of planning out your overdose... maybe he mean that the fact you were doing it PERIOD, was impulsive... meaning you haven't taken time to think of other options rather than the one. It can also be that you have more than just BPD and that can complicate your diagnoses A LOT... I have MANY dx and sometimes I have to stop and thing which one is messing with me today But those are my thoughts on them at least... so that is what it MEANS to ME... I hope you figure out your path and do well for yourself. :hug2:

[Kaje]

I've just been diagnosed (initially, anyway) with BPL (first psychiatrist consultation this morning).

As a student mental health nurse, I know a little - but not a lot - about it. We had a section of an hour session on it and one of the things that made me chuckle was the stigma attached. Though there's always a stigma attached with mental health conditions - all of them - as they're something we can't see, there's no tangible evidence as there is with a broken leg etc.

In the session, I did find out that the following are thought to have had BPL - and they're not all bad:

Princess Diana - Yep, according to some medical records, Princess Di was thought to have suffered from Borderline Personality Disorder

Jim Morrison - The Doors dude! Now he wasn't hated either!

Marilyn Monroe - Yep, even Mazzy Mo had BPL according to a few experts. Now, she's loved and adored by millions (as the others are).

Darth Vader - Yeah. I know. He's fictional. BUT a couple of well known psychiatric experts believe that Darth Vader/Anakin Skywalker suffered with Borderline Personality Disorder as they fit many of the associated traits. They even use it to explain the condition to students and patients alike. Now, being a Star Wars fan, I think that's the coolest of the lot!

It's a new thing for me, and it's no doubt going to be a struggle. I fit many of the classic traits of BPL - including, unfortunately, the manipulative personality trait, but I know I'll get through it somehow - and I know I can beat the stigma. Having this condition has done nothing but spur me on to raise awareness once I'm a qualified mental health professional and break down the social walls that still exist for those with similar conditions.

[Barbara A]

What the heck is BPL?

[Kaje]

Sorry for causing you so much obvious distress at my mistake of putting BPL when, of course, I obviously meant BPD.