Joshua Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 But we can administer real help!!! My life was at risk the other day and I had support from someone on the telephone, for 6+ hrs, and that helped to save my life. He wasn't their in person to physically stop me, but he accompanied me until I felt strong enough to go home. I've already said why mentioning current SH helps. Okay so he helped on that occasion. Trained or not i dont know... What if someone says something that doesent help, angers you? disagrees with you? pushes you to take a course of action you dont wish to? Should your reaction to any of these scenarios be on there head? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily-Bee Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 So if in a crisis it makes you feel better to hurt someone else then its ok?? Lilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 YES!!! You may believe that those in crisis should not be limited/restricted to the terms of life we all have to abide by but the fact is we are all equals in this respect and the rules exist whether in crisis or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Then why the f**k have we got MH professionals? They are there to help and guide us and to encourage us to be able to do that for ourselves. We need help to do that sometimes, and I would say that posting in crisis is a way of asking for that help when we can't get it elsewhere. Yes they are there to enable you, motivate you and support you. The keyword in all of that is you because ultimately change comes from within. You're missing the point now cos in times of crisis, people don't need challenging and telling that change comes from within etc because I know for me it only serves to make me feel judged even more and inadequate and even more likely to go ahead and do what I was planning to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piuma Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 I think some people are really not reading whats been said. THIS POST WAS ORIGINALLY ABOUT posting about the fact you have just done it or making a status saying so. Why should people avoid crisis section when they are trying to ehlp or need to post themselves, just so YOU can say im self harming right now or taking an overdose. How many of you have been the person at the other end of the computer waiting to hear if someone is dead or alive, praying that they make it, im sure some of you now will say oh yes i have, and i would do it again, but I have had my fair share of this, its happened numerous times, and mostly because i didnt know how to take a step back. I got involved my choice I know, Its not just about sh as in cutting you see, some people self harm by od'ing, drinking, ect, theirs many ways. i choose not to get involved anymore, thats me taking a risk and hoping that the people i care about dont make a mistake and end up dead. it might seem cold of me to step back, but i have nearly lost someone dear 3-4 times from this place, and i mean seriously nearly died, I am not willing to put myself in that situation ever again, cos it hurts my mental health. maybe makes me selfish dunno Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 This is exactly what im saying. People on this forum are not equpied to know whats best for you and may not be in a place to deal with the emotional consequences of your actions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Were not MH proffessionals though,were peers........do we put the kind of responcibility MH proffessionals have on members? Lilly No we don't, and I haven't asked for that to be done. But we, more than anyone, can understand what it's really like and share our experiences in an honest and frank way, and remind each other of what helps us at times of crisis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily-Bee Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 That you can do,thats what this forum is for. Lilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 But we can administer real help!!! My life was at risk the other day and I had support from someone on the telephone, for 6+ hrs, and that helped to save my life. He wasn't their in person to physically stop me, but he accompanied me until I felt strong enough to go home. I've already said why mentioning current SH helps. Okay so he helped on that occasion. Trained or not i dont know... What if someone says something that doesent help, angers you? disagrees with you? pushes you to take a course of action you dont wish to? Should your reaction to any of these scenarios be on there head? Damn, meant to neg that. Of course it shouldn't, and I haven't suggested that. If someone says something I don't like or find unhelpful, I need to ignore it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 So if in a crisis it makes you feel better to hurt someone else then its ok?? Lilly You're talking bullshit now and I've never said that. That is bang out of order to say that about me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily-Bee Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 You just said though if someone when youre in crisis says the wrong thing youre more inclined to do something rash,how would that make the other person feel?? Lilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily-Bee Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 If all rules are out the door in a crisis then hurting someone else would be ok too and you could be hurting someone without wanting to by for instance telling them too graphic details. Lilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 I think some people are really not reading whats been said. I would agree with you there! I think your point about worrying whether someone is dead or alive is relevant whether specific SH/OD has been mentioned or not. Simply by people talking about the fact they're in crisis, and then maybe disappearing for a while, can raise alarm bells big-time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 You just said though if someone when youre in crisis says the wrong thing youre more inclined to do something rash,how would that make the other person feel?? Lilly When did I say that? I said I would need to ignore it. By posting I accept I will find some people's responses more helpful than others, but would not hold them responsible for how their response made me feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily-Bee Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 I personally would worry even more though if before they dissapeared they posted they ODed....... Lilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 If all rules are out the door in a crisis then hurting someone else would be ok too and you could be hurting someone without wanting to by for instance telling them too graphic details. Lilly You're not listening to what I've been saying. I can understand why people think they are wasting their breath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 I personally would worry even more though if before they dissapeared they posted they ODed....... Lilly But you could equally take it that they've gone for help and that is why they've disappeared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily-Bee Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 You're missing the point now cos in times of crisis, people don't need challenging and telling that change comes from within etc because I know for me it only serves to make me feel judged even more and inadequate and even more likely to go ahead and do what I was planning to do. You implied here that if someone says the wrong thing they could make you act rash. Lilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 You're missing the point now cos in times of crisis, people don't need challenging and telling that change comes from within etc because I know for me it only serves to make me feel judged even more and inadequate and even more likely to go ahead and do what I was planning to do. You implied here that if someone says the wrong thing they could make you act rash. Lilly Possibly, but that's my responsibility and I would never hold them accountable for it. I was just explaining how talking about change coming from within is not the most helpful advice during times of crisis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily-Bee Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 I would still feel very bad if that was me trying to help you and ended up doing something rash,I would find that a lot to carry. Lilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelyheartemma Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 I'm so sorry Christine. I was trying to click positive and i negged you. I'll give you 2 +s in other posts and be more careful about it. i'm really sorry xxx I for one will never discuss sh on this forum again. because its not safe and because I have to think of others before my own needs ( a rule I Learnt as a child and validated here), as I know this started when I posted on status I haven't said anything yet. I do agree that saying stuff on updates is wrong and did apologies. I also think the evidence that there aren't enough of us on here to support people currently suicidal I think that is a bit thin,as I have seen many people get instant support if they post.Yes I know some people cant deal with it feel helpless or get triggered, maybe there should be a notice about how to respond or not if you feel someone is in imminent danger, which would be more reassuring rather that the current rule. There seems to be an assumption that people have help and support, can pick up a phone etc, well in my case thats not true, nor do I have any strategies, so IT that cant be named will continue, unhealthy as has been described. anyway rules are rules and this is,as I have found and experienced a dictatorship and not worth trying to change as you are wasting your time, The whole subject of a topic for sh has been suggested before and I think they had one once and stopped it, so I tale the rough with the smooth on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doormouse Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 This has been a difficult thread for me to read, but I chose to read all the way through, because I wanted to make sure what I wanted to say was relevant.... Like Piuma, I have sat on the end of the phone, or the computer, with someone I cared about having told me that they had done somthing which could potentially end their life. Even putting on my professional hat in those situations is no help at all. I couldn't sleep, was constantly worrying, I made myself ill. Equally, I've felt the urges to harm myself, I have hurt myself in the past. There is a huge difference between saying - "I feel the need to harm myself" or "last night I hurt myself but I went to casualty" and "I AM harming myself and I AM NOT seeking professional help." I'm not trying to underestimate or invalidate how bad anyone feels when they are in crisis - but posting whilst you are hurting yourself makes others feel helpless, and can push them into a crisis situation too. When you are in crisis, you aren't in a place where you can consider other people much, which I why I personally agree that there have to be rules against posting details about self harm or suicidal behaviours in which you are currently engaging in. There are places you can go in those situations, people you can call - the samaritans for example, and you can email them too. Just in a community like this we need to protect each other and ourselves. Hugs Mousexx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piuma Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 excellent reply mousey xxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toaster Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 thank u mousey for putting into words what i couldnt :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelyheartemma Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 I don't think theres anything we can do to change the mods minds. idk exactly what i think about it, i think its good the mods want to protect members, the thought behind it all is a good one. but it is really hard if you need help and you cant reach out to ppl on this site, ppl who know you. but i dont want to cause more arguments! just saying i can see both sides. but i think all we can really do is go along with what the mods have decided and if it doesnt work they might think again but it might turn out to be more ok than it seems but is it ok if i make 1 suggestion? in the original post it said that posts with sh in will be removed. but maybe it would be possible to edit them instead? so the sh bit is gone but the post is still there so ppl are still aware this person needs help and support? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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