'growing Out' Of Bpd

[brassed2bits]

Just been reading a thread where it was mentioned that people tend to 'grow out' of Bpd in their 40's.

Someone wrote that they were only 19, and not prepared to live with it for another 20 years!

Well I am nearly 40 now and have had these Bpd problems all my life, although only in the last few years has they been given the Bpd title.

I would rather have known at 19 what I 'had', and have had the chance to spend the last 20 years understanding myself a bit better, been supported, and avoiding all the self harm etc.

Only now, half way through my life have I got a diagnosis, and can start on the long road to recovery.

Does it mean that now I am nearly 40 recovery will be quicker?? I don't know.

All I can say is that I wish I had known earlier on. It would have saved a lot of heartache, pain, and I would have lived a far less dysfunctional life.

[Vorpalblade]

It was me that mentioned that we grow out of it in our 40's.

this of course is a generalisation and doesn't apply to everyone. the profs say that come our 40's we reach a state of natural "maturity" and we manage to overcome a lot of our BPD problems. Perhaps our wise mind fully develops at that age.

Tbh i haven't done a lot of research into it since i was told the prognosis, i was just kinda glad to hear it.

Blade

[MrsDerelictContent]

Hehe, & I'm the 19 year old .

I'm at a very significant stage in my life... training to be a clinical psychologist, I NEED to be well.

I did lots of research on the prognosis today, results here:

1)

Prognosis is difficult to assess. While the disorder is chronic in nature, gradual improvements with work are definitely seen. While it is difficult for anyone to change major aspects of their personality, the symptoms of this disorder can be reduced in both number and intensity. Long term treatment is almost always required.

2)

Short-term follow-up studies uniformly reveal that patients with BPD change little over time.

In a 1998 prospective follow-up study, Links et al reported that almost 50% of their former inpatients with BPD continued to meet diagnostic criteria at 7 years.

Furthermore, these patients have significantly more comorbid personality psychopathology; this finding supported the assertion that the level of pathology at the initial assessment primarily predicts the level of borderline psychopathology.

The long-term outcome is generally unknown.

However, the initial diagnosis of BPD is rarely made in patients older than 40 years.

This observation might reflect the evolution of BPD into more stable personality disorders, or perhaps patients with BPD stop seeking help as they age.

3)

Before adolescence, such psychological handicaps as concentration problems, learning disabilities, and social alienation are often present. Those problems gradually evolve into the classic symptoms of the disorder during adolescence and early adulthood. The course of borderline personality disorder is variable but is often characterized by severe dyscontrol of mood and impulses and by the high consumption of health care resources, especially during the 20s. In their 30s and 40s a significant number of patients (40 to 60 percent) appear to attain some stability in their relationships and vocational functioning.

4)

Although some patients improve as they grow older and have positive experiences in life, personality disorders are generally life-long disturbances with periods of worsening (exacerbations) and periods of improvement (remissions). Borderline patients are at high risk for developing substance abuse disorders or bulimia. About 80% of hospitalized borderline patients attempt suicide at some point during treatment, and about 5% succeed in committing suicide.

5)

The course of this illness varies and depends on the severity of the symptoms; the amount of stress; the availability of support; the degree of functional impairment; the extent of self-destructive or suicidal behavior; and the presence of other psychiatric disorders, such as depression or substance abuse. It also depends on the person's ability to stay in treatment. Some people are quite resolute and courageous about their treatment and are able to bear deep disappointment, even though it may be very difficult. Others, however, find themselves in a cycle of seeking help, then feeling rejected and rejecting the help.

Also, because this disorder is difficult to treat, some people find themselves poorly matched with a clinician, and the treatment turns out to be ineffective. As in the person's life, it is difficult for him or her to distinguish between real and exaggerated disappointment in a treatment setting. Many researchers are now more optimistic about the long-term outcomes in borderline personality disorder. With persistence, many people with this disorder eventually can resolve painful problems and have fewer symptoms, which ultimately leads to more comfortable relationships and satisfying life achievements.

6)

Borderline personality disorder has a poor outlook because noncompliance with treatment is common.

7)

In general, the prognosis for BPD is highly variable. Some patients improve, some stay the same and some get worse. Up to 10% of people diagnosed with the disorder eventually commit suicide.

8)

Borderline personality disorder has a poor outlook because non-compliance with treatment is common. It can lead to the following complications:

Drug abuse

Suicide attempts

Eating disorders

Depression

9)

I see medication as a main role in BPD until symptoms can be addressed in treatment (talk therapy). The prognosis for BPD is in direct relation to the skills of the treater (bad treater - bad prognosis). If I had my pick, I would select a mixture of psychodynamic with CBT. CBT can act as a custodial treatment (maintain and improve the here and now) while psychodynamic can help address and revise the deeper unresolved disturbances.

10)

A better prognosis seems to be indicated by:

high intelligence;

artistic talent;

physical attractiveness;

good education;

absence of transgenerational sexual or physical abuse;

lack of substance abuse;

no history of problems with the legal system.

The prognosis is worse in patients with a history of self-cutting, alcohol abuse and unemployment.

11)

Personality disorders are lifelong conditions.

[lie]

thanks for the good news.......................

and lots of valuable info

i do not know whether it would be good or not but i would like to know how old who is.. to me it seems to play a role in the behaviour... but maybe it is my prejudice :blush:

[pip]

OMG

Shoot me now

[Madeleine]

I echo Pip.... I'm stuffed! :(

[lostsoul]

nobody is stuffed. we all make our own fate. ok - so this article is pretty bleak i would say. but who is to say that the article is right?

everyone here has been proactive and taken an interest in getting better, in what their problems are, and we are all open to progress and changing ourselves

i would have thought that is the best way to get better, so nobody get sad and hopeless over this article ok?

you want to get better, you can and will

xx losty xx

[Vorpalblade]

excellent post MrsDC thankyou

[MrsDerelictContent]

Sorry for laughing but these were actually taken from the first 11 articles (NOT JUST ONE) found doing a search in google for 'borderline personality disorder prognosis'.

I feel I am stuffed.

I'm sorry for fueling hopelessness, but it's realistic isn't it?

I am sorry.

I didn't miss anything I found out because it was positive, I included everything!

This is it guys.

Is it any wonder I feel hopeless? Nobody has told me any different! Not one person. Nobody will lie to me, that's why!

I'm fucked.

[lie]

have deleted my post (was not valid), dunno how to do that without leaving a line, so just go over this..

[Madeleine]

Well (she says hopefully), at least we're all in this together!

[MrsDerelictContent]

have deleted my post (was not valid), dunno how to do that without leaving a line, so just go over this..

HUH???

What did the post say?

line? :S

[lie]

i wrote something and then i found out that i would prefer to delete it because it was based on wrong assumptions. so i clicked on "edit" and then i wanted to send an empty post which was not possible. so i had to write something - a line.

how do you delete messages?

[pip]

I am well fucked.

Love your optimism Losty

-wish I shared it.

Pip

x

[Eva*]

A better prognosis seems to be indicated by:

high intelligence;

artistic talent;

physical attractiveness;

good education;

absence of transgenerational sexual or physical abuse;

lack of substance abuse;

no history of problems with the legal system.

The prognosis is worse in patients with a history of self-cutting, alcohol abuse and unemployment.

OK, I'm confused now:

better prognosis for high intelligence (if I believe others and my opinion on good days)

artistic talent (the same)

physical attractiveness (same again)

good education

lack of substance abuse;

no history of problems with the legal system.

worse for self-cutting and transgenerational sexual or physical abuse

what it is now?

[pip]

I'm at a very significant stage in my life... training to be a clinical psychologist, I NEED to be well.

Does that mean you are doing a degree in Psychology?

Just being nosey as I am doing one too

-to go with my degree in Zoology

and PhD in cryopreservation in DNA

and pharmaceutical exams.

Where are you studying?

Pip

x

[MrsDerelictContent]

Yep!

I'm doing degree in Psychology, with intentions to then do clinical psychology.

I'm studying at Roehampton University South West London. I love it there.

[pip]

Cool

Lots of luck

You have a way to go before becoming a clinical psychologist

-I'm sure you will make it!!!!!!!!

Have faith

you will get there

Pip

x

[ali]

you are ALL so BRAINY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

bloody hell i,m 45 so i have CHANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

take care you 'BOFFINS' on BPD

ali xx

[MrsDerelictContent]

Definitely a while yet, but I still need to be well.

I spent half of the time of my first year either in hospital or at hospital appointments - missing lectures.

I was quite ill.

Don't want a repeat performance. But am not too hopeful.

I'm not that brainy.

[pip]

I got faith in you.

If you ever need to repeat a year they will let you on medical grounds

(I did)

You will be fine

Pip

x

[allpsychedout]

Hi--I just wanted to say that I've read through this thread, so at my age (beyond my 40s, that's for sure!) I consider myself to have been a 'slow learner'. For me, it took the completion of menopause to begin to bring me the most 'wisdom' about my afflictions, and let me start to rest a little easier, dealing with them.

BPD doesn't even mean today, what it did 30-some years ago. There are aspects of it I never experienced, according to today's guidelines. Guess I'd for sure be one of those listed on that 'better prognosis' list, as those things described what I used to be like, before all the autoimmune stuff hit me and wrecked the good possibilites left for my life.

Somewhere along the line, I think I just gave up trying to 'get better' or 'become acceptable in society' again. 'Jobs and work' greatly exacerbated my physical illnesses, employers were extremely unkind, and I got tired of office bullies, so when I got laid off my last job I just never went out and found another. I knew I'd not be able to DO it for more than perhaps a month, anyway. People and relationships hurt far more in the long run than aloneness, so I became rather a recluse. My world became very small, and I lived it in shades of grey. What few people I ever did see, were also grey. But this didn't feel like depression, because I overcame nearly all the former sadness; it felt like overwhelming fatigue.

Once in a while, I can come out of this turtle shell of protection I'm in, if I find another (or several others) who appear to think and feel much as I do, about 'things'. After reading that long post on Inverted Narcissism in which I recognized many aspects of myself (though not some of the 'worst' ones), I can honestly say, however, that I am tired of my earthly journey through so much pain. It's good to read what others think about these hypersensitivities, and what disorder or other we manifest because of them, and due to others' treatment of us who have them.

But much as I appreciate the opportunity to read about these ideas and theories, it can also become a study in pure frustration. There are endless labels followed by yet more labels, which merely attempt to categorize emotional pain and shove us into neat little boxes. Somewhere, there needs to be an end to the suffering, doesn't there? Not to mention, an end to the TOTAL humiliation in trying to deal with health care systems which don't care one little bit about us? Is it REALLY the best thing to simply medicate us into oblivion? So that we'll just 'go away' and become invisible? Or to torture us with therapy after therapy until we use up all our money and then have to go back to dealing with 'life' by ourselves anyway?

If others reach a point in their lives where the BPD or other symptoms just aren't hurting them much anymore, or even have nearly gone away, then, wonderful! For me, though, the game has played out differently. For every 'recovery' I seem to have made, two new worse maladies have popped up. The more I have 'tried', the more I have became beaten down, by some kind of cosmic force or maybe even karmic 'retribution'. This--I can only call it 'force'--has seemed determined that I should never know real success for long, that I should never be 'loved', that I should never be well enough to accomplish and complete meaningful work, that I should never be able to earn a real living, and that I should always live with the fear of impending poverty. The one thing I do not fear at all, is death.

I do NOT believe that these notions came only out of my own head. I continually go through a process, now, of just learning to 'accept' these horrors as the reality I think I am supposed to live through. That doesn't mean I should attempt to make others suffer from any of my consequential destiny, or even allow such to occur. Sometimes I still get angry about it, but I feel that the whole point may be, to learn to accept my fate enough that it becomes not such a terror any more. I believe I shall be forced to endure 'life', here on earth, until I learn that lesson. The concept does become less difficult for me to comprehend, the older I get. I'm so looking forward to crossing over into that other realm I have visited a few times, and being allowed to finally stay there. For me, surely that will be my point of 'recovery'.

So--could growing out of BPD or bipolar or any other painful emotional disorder be a form of 'acceptance' of whatever we must deal with so long as we are still alive? I won't even get into any fairness/unfairness discussion. We all certainly know that we do not come into this world 'equal' in any way whatsoever...

Just my rambling thoughts, on this matter.

allpsychedout

[zasspa]

I have to agree with some of the others: Im stuffed too!!!!!!

I'm at a very significant stage in my life... training to be a clinical psychologist, I NEED to be well

Me too!!! Ive been studying for 6 months and already I have to take the rest of the year off cause Im too sick If I keep going this way its going to take me a loooong time as this is a 6 year degree here!!!

[Betsy]

1) have been in and out of treatment for 45 years

2) many comorbid psychological dx's. dx'd at 56

3)was very symptomatic at 14, 30's and 40's were RELATIVELY calm years.

4) worsening (exacerbations) and periods of improvement (remissions

suicide attemps

5)stress and comorbid conditions really affect treatment

6) non-compiance? you mean like when i went off my meds all at once...who me?

7) have improved over the years

8) Drug abuse - when younger

Suicide attempts - several

Eating disorders-since childhood

Depression - almost constant

9) for me medication is important but mostly for comorbid conditions. trust in your therapist is an ABSOLUTE necessity

10)high intelligence; hummmm

artistic talent; i think so, i do have a degree in art

physical attractiveness; no

good education; yes

absence of transgenerational sexual or physical abuse; humm

lack of substance abuse; not since 20's

no history of problems with the legal system. Thank God and someone looking over me.

11)Personality disorders are lifelong conditions.... this is possibly true, however you don't have to react the same way all your life. underlying personality may remain the same by logical thinking can make change. If the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.. i would say we are not insane.. we are capable of recognizing what is wrong.. and with work we are capable of changing our reactions to that stimuli.

just thoughts on your post MDC.. very interesting composite you put together for us.. thanks

allpsyched out ....... i agree with lots of what you said but bipolar is chemical based and not considered a personality disorder. however as a comorbid condition i think it's a bitch with bpd... just my oppion.

thanks everyone for commenting on this.. very interesting.

bets

[Promethius]

Hmm. Well, Ive just turned 30 (GAH!) and for me BPD has definately got easier to deal with. Mind you, I wasnt diagnosed until I was 28, so to some extent my 'recovery' is more about an increased understanding than anything else. I too wish Id know what was wrong with me when I was younger. I think those of you in your twenties and teens who know you have BPD have an opportunity to do much better with your lives than I ever managed. Im kinda envious.