For Crying Out Loud.

[Kelliemanic]

Seriously though.

I do actually find it a bit distressing that any thread can end up in the "peacekeepers special forum" and can be picked to pieces, and discussed in minute detail, in front of everyone else.

Before finally having a fitting "punishment" doled out by a group of people who may or may not be friends, who I can only assume have been selected due to a) their superior personalities OR their popularity

(Seriously correct me if I'm wrong. I don't know if anyone's been given a reason as to why they've become peacekeeper, I'm just clutching at straws here....educate me)

It's all well and good while it's just a few people who have obviously crossed the line...or the odd person who's really new here and doesn't know the rules...or a troll, but what happens when one of the peacekeeper's friends is in the firing line?

Someone we all know well, and speak to everyday?

Are we sure everyone's going to be just as fair doling out punishment to a moderator as they would someone like me? or ziggy? or anyone else that has the balls to speak up for themselves (and others) and "causes trouble"

I don't think I want to be a peacekeeper,

I wouldn't be able to randomly decide whether to remove someone from a forum that might be their lifeline because they mentioned jesus.

I wouldn't be able to deal with the favouratism that WILL occur.

And I really wouldn't like to be hypocritical enough to punish someone who's in the same situation I am, probably doing something I have done time after time in the past.

Sorry Josh...peacekeeping is what the moderators are for.

[Kelliemanic]

Okay, It has just come to my attention that I have been given the title "peacekeeper"

I could backtrack, and say I'm really honored and all of that.

But I am genuinely going to stick by my guns.

I love jumping into the arguments on the forum, and really discussing some gritty topics with people.

I have said things in topics in the past that have offended, and annoyed some people...but that's me.

It's in my nature to question...and argue.

How can someone like that keep the peace? How can I honestly judge someone else and decide their fate knowing that I've broken the rules in the past...and prolly will do again.

How can any of you?

Maybe I'm too soft....

Joshua, you are an awesome guy, and I love ya to bits...

But i don't think I will be any good at this.

You should probably give it to someone who could do a better job of it or something.

Kells

xx

[Long Time Man]

I shouldn't imagine this'll end up in the 'special' place at all. Rightly, it shouldn't.

I can understand the points you have made, particularly about the privacy issue. I agree that conducting an inquest so publicly is not my favourite solution to any of the problems that may arise. I don't know how the other Peacekeepers feel about it as I don't have any contact with them.

As for how people react when its someone they know that are put up for inquisition remains to be seen. I guess you just have to have faith in the system until then. I know that sounds tediously diplomatic, but I just can't see what else to suggest really. Hopefully, if any of us found ourselves in that situation, we would just hold our hands up and say "I can't do this, I probably won't be impartial."

I do know how I became a Peacekeeper though.....well not specifically this role, but I know how my name ended up in the mix so to speak.

[Kelliemanic]

I'm especially baffled.

I've been here five minutes.

Have precisely 0 people on my profile list of friends.

(Not that I don't like any of you)

And spend most of my time getting into scraps with ziggy about gun laws/politics/religion.

How the hell did I end up a peace keeper.

I couldn't keep the peace even if this was a forum for monks.

:huh:

[Long Time Man]

I reckon that that's what will make you an ideal part of the peacekeeping group then. Your independence.

I'm not saying they knew that from the outset, just as they don't know that about me.

Maybe we should all have to swear a blood-oath or something - a peacekeeping rite of passage and bear the sign of our duty to clean up (keep clean) Dodge City. I'm leaning towards a natty tattoo and a commitment never to sleep on the job!!!

[Kelliemanic]

I reckon that that's what will make you an ideal part of the peacekeeping group then. Your independence.

I'm not saying they knew that from the outset, just as they don't know that about me.

Maybe we should all have to swear a blood-oath or something - a peacekeeping rite of passage and bear the sign of our duty to clean up (keep clean) Dodge City. I'm leaning towards a natty tattoo and a commitment never to sleep on the job!!!

I just did a peacekeeping thing.

you can read it and tell me what an awful job I did of it.

I just find it funny... a bunch of BPD's telling off a fellow BPD for discussing her experience of BPD...

:lol:

[Long Time Man]

Naw, it wasn't an awful attempt - just an honest one.

I did something vaguely similar with the religion one earlier and flew in the face of public opinion, so I know what response you'll get - "It is'nt for the peacekeepers to decide on whether it is a breach or not, but to just vote on the consequence's of it"

If we carry on like this we won't be peacekeeping for long. LOL

[Kelliemanic]

Naw, it wasn't an awful attempt - just an honest one.

I did something vaguely similar with the religion one earlier and flew in the face of public opinion, so I know what response you'll get - "It is'nt for the peacekeepers to decide on whether it is a breach or not, but to just vote on the consequence's of it"

If we carry on like this we won't be peacekeeping for long. LOL

I don't know whether to give it a go or not.

I guess if people have read this thread then they'll know that I don't have enough friends to have favourates...I won't slag them off in the peacekeepers forum, and if I think they were in the right I'd fight their corner...

I reckon Joshua will realise his mistake, and I'll be little ol' member by the morning...*grin*

Still...it was nice to get my opinion out about the whole ***MAY TRIGGER*** thing...

That really does need sorting out.

[Long Time Man]

Go on.......give it a go. Feel the POWER!!

I can't imagine they'd strip you of the position just because you voiced your opinion. I think its the best thing we can do - far better than having a peacekeeping group that will always vote the same en-masse. As you said yourself earlier, lively debate never hurt no-one.........unless you're lively debating with pointed sticks or summink!

[Kelliemanic]

Go on.......give it a go. Feel the POWER!!

I can't imagine they'd strip you of the position just because you voiced your opinion. I think its the best thing we can do - far better than having a peacekeeping group that will always vote the same en-masse. As you said yourself earlier, lively debate never hurt no-one.........unless you're lively debating with pointed sticks or summink!

That's just it.

I've been given the power to criticise and punish people who are by the definition of BPD unable to take criticism well, without feeling negative about themselves.

I can only imagine the embarrassment as people wade through your post (That may have been posted in the safe place section, and can now be read by everyone)

Can I put myself up for punishment?

I've talked about dodgy things.... Should I go and search all those posts and report myself?

:(

[zarah]

Kellie - I can relate to how you feel

I have concerns that if someone is upset enough to break the rules and post something they shouldn't then us discussing that in minute detail in public is like - well it would push me over the edge - I don't know about the rest of the world

I am not going to be around much for a few days - will be interested when I come back to see how this is all working or not working.

[laura_25]

I agree with Zarah. I feel upset that paine's mistake or whatever it should be called is being discussed so openly in front of everyone when this would not have not been the case a few weeks ago. I think if she comes back and reads it all she would feel humiliated. I also feel scared to voice my opinion here incase the same thing happens to me.

[celticgirl]

I agree.....many of us are seriously battling with low self esteem,fear of rejection/not being good enough etc....having words picked to bits that may have been posted in a desperate time then being unable to reply to the debate that ensues could be very damaging.For my part,i feel very much pushed out by this,not good enough......there seems to be no clarity on why people are picked to be peace keepers and no clear statement for all to read about the difference in responsibilities between mods and peacekeepers. Kellie's post really hit the nail on the head for me.Making judgements about people who can have no chance to reply in that thread....how many of us can say with absolute certainty that we won't post something that will be deemed against the rules,because at that moment we are desperate? The rules are there to keep people safe,and people have to take responsibility for what they post......but none of us are immune from making mistakes,and debating such issues publicly is humiliating and even more damaging at a time when someone is vulnerable.As for public apologies for such a post.....seems like the online equivalent of putting someone in the stocks,and i thought we were long past that.

[InnerPeace]

I think the peacekeepers idea is actually a very clever one.

I don't think we're discussing Paine's post in minute detail, what we're doing is having a fair and understanding discussion about the best way to deal with the breach of the rules. No one is making light of her situation or being unkind.

Yes it will be embarrassing being discussed but being open is maybe better than knowing the post is being discussed behind closed doors. Do you not see how this becomes a community thing, more of us are taking ownership etc? Also, we don't have to post anything unless we are suggesting an alternative to the suggested options, it's a closed poll. The fact that we have the forum acts as a deterrant and everyone can see what type of behaviour breaks the rules and so re-enforces them.

I don't think we have to worry about the favouritism issues, there is such a broad mix of us that it's not going to make an impact if we have a friend in the "special place" (that really cracks me up) or the dock or whatever we want to call it. I also don't think any of us would be vindictive enough to give a higher punishment than warranted and there again the mix and numbers would prevent that.

It's a good point though about Safe Place, the rule is posts don't get moved from there so maybe Josh can let us know what happens in that situation.

[Amanda28]

I think the rules here are fair not too many, I also have been through dbt and there are rules there as well, one comes to mind, no showing of recent sh, this in my opinion is dumb, butt for some is can cause get harm, and as for the peace keepers there are enough where someone will be on at some point, they can hide posts such as the ones from computers that come and try and get us to go to their sites, so I don't see a problem, many other site have rules, I was recently turn down from a Christian site because I don't practice religion so this rule are on the less side.

Amanda

[Amanda28]

and one other thing, as for the public viewing of post I'd rather have that and know how the peacekeepers deal with the post than not.

[InnerPeace]

I agree.....many of us are seriously battling with low self esteem,fear of rejection/not being good enough etc....having words picked to bits that may have been posted in a desperate time then being unable to reply to the debate that ensues could be very damaging.For my part,i feel very much pushed out by this,not good enough......there seems to be no clarity on why people are picked to be peace keepers and no clear statement for all to read about the difference in responsibilities between mods and peacekeepers. Kellie's post really hit the nail on the head for me.Making judgements about people who can have no chance to reply in that thread....how many of us can say with absolute certainty that we won't post something that will be deemed against the rules,because at that moment we are desperate? The rules are there to keep people safe,and people have to take responsibility for what they post......but none of us are immune from making mistakes,and debating such issues publicly is humiliating and even more damaging at a time when someone is vulnerable.As for public apologies for such a post.....seems like the online equivalent of putting someone in the stocks,and i thought we were long past that.

If people feel negatively about the introduction of the peacekeeper role, surely this is an opportunity for growth? We are all responsible for our own reactions to things, we can't make the world turn around us, we need to take personal responsibility and see why we feel negatively and do what it takes to overcome that.

Josh doesn't have to explain why certain people were chosen and others not but if you look at who was you'll see that it's a broad mix of people and that seems sensible. There is clarity about the roles, Josh has already explained it.

No-one is picking words to bits or making judgments in the posts...it has already been decided that the posts are a breach of the rules, the peacekeepers as fellow members choose the action to be taken as a result.

Of course none of us are immune from making mistakes and could break the rules but we all know, and always did know, that we must comply by the rules every time we post. The only thing that's changed is that people who break the rules may find doing so more uncomfortable but by the same token, they may find it more comforting knowing their peers are deciding what will be done rather than staff. Breaking the rules is breaking the rules, why shouldn't there be consequences? Why shouldn't there be a deterrant? If people feel it's ok to break the rules because nothing really will be done, they'll just keep doing it. The rules are there for our protection...I want people to know they have to abide by the rules, don't you?

[celticgirl]

Yes it is an opportunity for growth......as i stated in my vent post yesterday,my feelings are my responsibility...but i stand by all i have said in this post.Maybe i have missed the point somewhere but i feel clarity is sadly lacking about this whole issue.It is obviously Joshua's right to change things for the benefit of the group....it is his site after all.However,the changes appeared suddenly quite without warning and i for one would have appreciated a thorough clarification of what this means to all of us.Initially it seemed the peace keepers were as bemused as the rest of us about their role.....and yes a wide variety of people were chosen for this,but there has been no clear and open explanation to the whole group as to how and why people were picked.....a big trigger for feelings of rejection and insecurity.Those feelings are mine to deal with.....and from exchanges i've had with other people,theirs to deal with too.I'm not trying to abdicate responsibility for my feelings,i am stating how this affects me,and how i perceive things right now.I still stand by what i have said re posts that may or have broken the rules.....rules need to be enforced,but people need to be dealt with as individuals taking into account their circumstances....if it were my post being discussed in this way,i would find that much harder than a member of staff privately handling the issue.If someone persistently breaks the rules then dealing with them in public may be a better option.....but when someone is clearly at the end of their tether,i think this approach is unhelpful at best and potentially dangerous at worst.Again,these are my opinions....but i shall state them honestly and continue to do so.

[InnerPeace]

I do understand where you're coming from but not everyone will feel the same way. Amamda posted how she'd rather see the process in action than not and I would too. Peacekeeps do have a different role from mods and I think it is a good idea. It is a change but things will settle down.

[InnerPeace]

At least we're zapping that spam out of existence a lot faster now!!

[celticgirl]

YAYYYY!!!!!! Good .....that'll stop those annoying bloody spam robots........

[InnerPeace]

In fact...I don't think spam really needs to be reported. The peacekeepers are regular visitors and see it there, I often get the alert email at the same time I see it myself anyway.

[Miko]

- It's a bad idea to set such a short 24 hour limit on responding constructively to a post.

- I have a point about whether pills can be considered "out" or not "out" which I think will turn out not to be of true significance to the original issue, which may be of help to PW I hope

- There is only one section where others should not be expected to reply. That must not be extended to additional areas of the forum but we must hold firm to that original policy.

- Any post was shared with us all to illustrate where one human being is and in a sense to help us all simply through knowing that . It therefore does not cause the poster like PW any excessive "exposure anxiety" to read responses which are similarly motivated.

- We should - I know it's a lot of trouble - look through the person's other threads and try to add constructively to them too. Perhaps we can talk the person into stabilising their attitude by giving them all kinds of helpful facts. Let's face it our resources must stretch a lot wider than the doom laden s*** the official propagandists give us. Some of our number have gradually pulled up over a period of interacting here many times.

Let's keep this real because as long as I've known it this forum has been head & shoulders superior to any other on related subjects.

[Joshua]

peacekeepers are basically members of the site that have been here a while, post a lot, and are kind of trusted not to misuse the use of the tools they receive as a peacekeeper

there should end up being more peacekeepers than members in the long run

we identify new ones daily. And it has nothing to do with good or naughty members

no one should feel good or bad for being picked or not

peace keepers are here to stay. Push all you like.

[celticgirl]

Thanks for explaining more about who peace keepers are Josh.....makes it a little clearer to me.

Cheers,Kate x....ps don't think having peace keepers is a bad idea at all.....my concern is more about how this will work,and about dealing with the feelings that change and differences bring..