Any Atheist Who Celebrates Xmas Is A Wimp!

[Jeeves]

Lots of judgement going on here...what the hell does it really matter? To each their own!!! Your athiest...well your borderline. Your christian...well your bipolar. Your a satanist...well your depressed blah, blah, blah,....it all boils down to the freedom of choice to be who we want to be and as long as we are not raping, murdering, etc....who the hells cares. We are on a 'mental health' forum, so in my way of thinking...who the hell are any of us to judge another and their choices????

[scarletgal]

I thought that was what I said. but concur regardless of how I put it originally.

Lots of judgement going on here...what the hell does it really matter? To each their own!!! Your athiest...well your borderline. Your christian...well your bipolar. Your a satanist...well your depressed blah, blah, blah,....it all boils down to the freedom of choice to be who we want to be and as long as we are not raping, murdering, etc....who the hells cares. We are on a 'mental health' forum, so in my way of thinking...who the hell are any of us to judge another and their choices????

[AleBD]

Lots of judgement going on here...what the hell does it really matter? To each their own!!! Your athiest...well your borderline. Your christian...well your bipolar. Your a satanist...well your depressed blah, blah, blah,....it all boils down to the freedom of choice to be who we want to be and as long as we are not raping, murdering, etc....who the hells cares. We are on a 'mental health' forum, so in my way of thinking...who the hell are any of us to judge another and their choices????

I agree. So much nonsense! Yes Xmas has become a comercial thing. But I enjoy all my family getting together once a year and my kids feel happy. So if that makes me a hypocrate, well I am. Not religious at all. But when I see my kids happy, its all worth it!

HELLO!!! THIS IS A MENTAL HEALTH FORUM! We all here have something that triggers us. BPD, Bipolar, etc. Take the posts from who they comes, dont take it so seriously ffs! I did once and made a big mistake.

we have real problems, please, lets heal. Everyone will enjoy their xmas as they wish anyway.

Hugs to all, peace!

[Ziggy_Encaoua]

i think someone who denied south africa for years and now waves a flag of the country after winning the world cup rugby is a wimp.

Oi I was in South Africa in '95 when we won last

[Ziggy_Encaoua]

so out of curiousty then can i ask you both ziggy and vorblade, will neither of you over that period be visiting family, not eating turkey on the 25th of december.

My family don't want to know me & would be cuntish towards me even they did

I hate turkey

[samsung]

95 was good match!!!!

[Ocean Wolf]

so out of curiousty then can i ask you both ziggy and vorblade, will neither of you over that period be visiting family, not eating turkey on the 25th of december.

My family don't want to know me & would be cuntish towards me even they did

I hate turkey

I'm sorry to hear that, Ziggy.

I guess I was too judgmental in that last post of mine. I don't respond well to being told I shouldn't do something I enjoy for no particular reason. Or I reason that I don't care about anyway.

[Ziggy_Encaoua]

95 was good match!!!!

Yeah no one expected that we'd win hehehehe

[stinkyboy]

Though at the time this article is written its early November the shops are full of Xmas products & you can’t watch an hour of television without being saturated with adverts selling attempting to sell you those products. Soon enough Xmas decorations will be going up in the high streets of towns thorough out the land & the conditioned masses get caught up in the so called Xmas spirit. But if you’re an atheist & declare you don’t celebrate Xmas then its likely people will call you scrooge & then snarl at you.

They snarl at you for saying Xmas Day has no significance that for any genuine atheist it’s simply just December 25th. People seem register & respect that Jews don’t celebrate. Moslems don’t celebrate nor Hindus or Sikhs. In fact due to political correctness people will go out of their way to respect that there are followers of religious faiths who don’t celebrate Xmas but atheists get snarled at & slammed as scrooges. It doesn’t help that many an atheist sells out & celebrate Xmas.

There are even anti-theists who celebrate Xmas & it makes one wonder if the reason happens to do with presents under the Xmas tree addressed to these individuals. I’ve heard atheists attempt to manipulate Xmas saying that these days it’s merely but a secular celebration. Sure corporation & big business have hijacked Christmas to sell crap which by the day after Xmas a good deal of people have become bored with. But even if Christmas has become an excuse for business to sell crap to the masses, Christians are always protesting that we must never forget the meaning of Christmas & maybe atheists should never forget what Christmas really is about.

However one might try to deny it Christmas still has & will always have religious, supernatural & spiritual significant, the kind of stuff which atheists & definitely anti-theists are meant to reject. By its very name Christmas is the celebration of the birth of Christ & Christ means pretty much the son of God. Maybe atheists need to be reminded that if one declares themselves an atheist they can’t celebrate the birth of the son of God because atheists don’t believe in God! Of course some atheists say they don’t see Jesus as the messiah or the son of God they see him as a philosopher of some note. Yes a philosopher who preached God existed & that he was the son of that God. I repeat if you declare you’re an atheist it’s then anachronistic to be celebrating somebody who claimed to be the son of God. Plus doing so all because they’re presents under the tree address to you shows how much of wimp you are to the temptations of religious belief.

Okay agnostics can wriggle out from the issue of Christmas because they’re wimps by nature. But if you declare you’re an atheist there should be no excuse to wimp out because it doesn’t do the atheistic cause any good at because it gives the impression to the unenlightened masses that atheists are prepared to sell out to religious & supernatural belief & that any atheist who keeps to the principles of atheism is some kook. Even some atheists might accuse the position being expressed in this article as militant & extremist. No its not an extremist or militant position, it’s a position which is expressing that maybe those who declare themselves as atheist should actually live by atheist principles & not sell out giving those of us who are genuine atheists a harder time trying to get respect from the masses because they think we’ll sell out for a dime & if don’t we are kooks & scrooges.

Genuine atheists aren’t scrooges or killjoys no atheist is trying to prevent people from celebrating Xmas. It’s more likely those who want prevent folk from celebrating Xmas are more likely to come from factions with in Christianity or from factions of other religious faiths. What atheists such as myself want is not to be snarled at & accused of being a kook or a scrooge & that it would be nice to have some respect for the principles genuine atheists live by.

Ziggy

http://www.thedeviantlibertarian.net/

Gee, lighten up, you might enjoy life more. Oh, i know it's early but Merry Christmas anyway. steve

[Ocean Wolf]

Lots of judgement going on here...what the hell does it really matter? To each their own!!! Your athiest...well your borderline. Your christian...well your bipolar. Your a satanist...well your depressed blah, blah, blah,....it all boils down to the freedom of choice to be who we want to be and as long as we are not raping, murdering, etc....who the hells cares. We are on a 'mental health' forum, so in my way of thinking...who the hell are any of us to judge another and their choices????

Actually, I think this discussion does matter. Not what religion we are or if we celebrate Christmas. Who else here finds the statement that we're wimps if we celebrate Christmas invalidating? Your right, it does all boil down to freedom of choice, but it's still invalidating to be called a wimp like that. This is a mental health forum. It's a borderline personality forum and part of borderline personality is feeling invalidated isn't it?

[samsung]

well ziggy this here, me being in england... i love rubbing it into the english faces.

i cant believe we won them 36 -0 in the first round of the RWC and then played shit against them in the final.

we could have kicked their asses well good.

but like they say, any landing you can walk away from is a good landing.

[dollydaydream]

hello ziggy, can u tell me what a kook is please?

obviously you have a good point to make,and its hit a sore nerve for you, and yes i agree, a real atheist wouldnt celebrate christmas. !!!

i have my own sort of beliefs when i am able to think for myself, im pagan.

everyones entitled to their own beliefs and opinions, if someone `celebrates` on 25th december, by doing anything remotely good , no matter what it is, then surely if you leave religion out of it, theres no harm in it,

putting beliefs aside, i dont care what people beleive in as long as its not harming or hurting anybody and is bringing a bit of a smile into the world, because of that, ill go along with celebrating christmas day, because to me its not a religious day, its a day when people all over the world are able to express their love for one another , and i dont care what the hell for,

let every day be a christmas day xxxx dd

[Ziggy_Encaoua]

Though at the time this article is written its early November the shops are full of Xmas products & you can’t watch an hour of television without being saturated with adverts selling attempting to sell you those products. Soon enough Xmas decorations will be going up in the high streets of towns thorough out the land & the conditioned masses get caught up in the so called Xmas spirit. But if you’re an atheist & declare you don’t celebrate Xmas then its likely people will call you scrooge & then snarl at you.

They snarl at you for saying Xmas Day has no significance that for any genuine atheist it’s simply just December 25th. People seem register & respect that Jews don’t celebrate. Moslems don’t celebrate nor Hindus or Sikhs. In fact due to political correctness people will go out of their way to respect that there are followers of religious faiths who don’t celebrate Xmas but atheists get snarled at & slammed as scrooges. It doesn’t help that many an atheist sells out & celebrate Xmas.

There are even anti-theists who celebrate Xmas & it makes one wonder if the reason happens to do with presents under the Xmas tree addressed to these individuals. I’ve heard atheists attempt to manipulate Xmas saying that these days it’s merely but a secular celebration. Sure corporation & big business have hijacked Christmas to sell crap which by the day after Xmas a good deal of people have become bored with. But even if Christmas has become an excuse for business to sell crap to the masses, Christians are always protesting that we must never forget the meaning of Christmas & maybe atheists should never forget what Christmas really is about.

However one might try to deny it Christmas still has & will always have religious, supernatural & spiritual significant, the kind of stuff which atheists & definitely anti-theists are meant to reject. By its very name Christmas is the celebration of the birth of Christ & Christ means pretty much the son of God. Maybe atheists need to be reminded that if one declares themselves an atheist they can’t celebrate the birth of the son of God because atheists don’t believe in God! Of course some atheists say they don’t see Jesus as the messiah or the son of God they see him as a philosopher of some note. Yes a philosopher who preached God existed & that he was the son of that God. I repeat if you declare you’re an atheist it’s then anachronistic to be celebrating somebody who claimed to be the son of God. Plus doing so all because they’re presents under the tree address to you shows how much of wimp you are to the temptations of religious belief.

Okay agnostics can wriggle out from the issue of Christmas because they’re wimps by nature. But if you declare you’re an atheist there should be no excuse to wimp out because it doesn’t do the atheistic cause any good at because it gives the impression to the unenlightened masses that atheists are prepared to sell out to religious & supernatural belief & that any atheist who keeps to the principles of atheism is some kook. Even some atheists might accuse the position being expressed in this article as militant & extremist. No its not an extremist or militant position, it’s a position which is expressing that maybe those who declare themselves as atheist should actually live by atheist principles & not sell out giving those of us who are genuine atheists a harder time trying to get respect from the masses because they think we’ll sell out for a dime & if don’t we are kooks & scrooges.

Genuine atheists aren’t scrooges or killjoys no atheist is trying to prevent people from celebrating Xmas. It’s more likely those who want prevent folk from celebrating Xmas are more likely to come from factions with in Christianity or from factions of other religious faiths. What atheists such as myself want is not to be snarled at & accused of being a kook or a scrooge & that it would be nice to have some respect for the principles genuine atheists live by.

Ziggy

http://www.thedeviantlibertarian.net/

Gee, lighten up, you might enjoy life more.

Keep your head buried in the sand because you seem to like being buggered

[Ocean Wolf]

Well, I guess if you keep calling people wimps for their personal choices, no one will want you that way... or any way... or at all. People tend to not like being insulted because of their personal choices. Including you. Aren't you doing the same thing as the people you accuse of calling you a scrooge because your personal choices?

No, being an atheist who doesn't celebrate christmas doesn't make you a scrooge. Is that what you wanted to hear? Well, it's true. However, calling people who do celebrate christmas (and agnostics) wimps is being a scrooge. And, yes, people who insult other people for not celebrating christmas are also being scrooges.

[Ziggy_Encaoua]

Well, I guess if you keep calling people wimps for their personal choices, no one will want you that way... or any way... or at all. People tend to not like being insulted because of their personal choices. Including you. Aren't you doing the same thing as the people you accuse of calling you a scrooge because your personal choices?

No because if you actually read what I wrote I said those who claim to be one thing & then do another are the ones who are wimps if nobody claims to be an atheist & celebrates Xmas fine but if you do claim to be an atheist then must learn to take the rough with the smooth.

[Ocean Wolf]

Okay agnostics can wriggle out from the issue of Christmas because they’re wimps by nature. But if you declare you’re an atheist there should be no excuse to wimp out because it doesn’t do the atheistic cause any good at because it gives the impression to the unenlightened masses that atheists are prepared to sell out to religious & supernatural belief & that any atheist who keeps to the principles of atheism is some kook.

Ziggy

http://www.thedeviantlibertarian.net/

What's that first sentence then?

And after... I had no idea there was an atheist cause. I just thought it was a lack of spiritual belief. I thought it was something one chooses because it feels right to them more than a cause or obligation.

[Ziggy_Encaoua]

Okay agnostics can wriggle out from the issue of Christmas because they’re wimps by nature. But if you declare you’re an atheist there should be no excuse to wimp out because it doesn’t do the atheistic cause any good at because it gives the impression to the unenlightened masses that atheists are prepared to sell out to religious & supernatural belief & that any atheist who keeps to the principles of atheism is some kook.

Ziggy

http://www.thedeviantlibertarian.net/

What's that first sentence then?

Agnostics are fence sitters in other words wimps

[Ocean Wolf]

Actually, they are people who believe something is out there, but they aren't sure what. At least, that's the definition I learned. I have never seen anything legitimate that says:

Agnostic: 1. fence sitter 2. wimp

Atheism: a cause, an obligation (not what people choose because it suits them)

Non-atheists: unenlightened masses that care what atheists do

If that suits you, fine. But don't push it on other people or you are no better than religious people who try to convert others. Despite what you are preaching (yes, that is preaching), everyone has the right to believe whatever suits them. Even if they're atheists. Want to argue that? Aren't you anti-disastablishment (sp?) and wanting people to be individuals? Or is it just that you want people to be like you? Sounds pretty conformist. And like a dictatorship. What argument can you come up with for that?

And that's not all. You are an atheist because you belive there is nothing out there right? The argument atheists tend to use is "Prove that it exists" right? Ok, prove that it doesn't. Science hasn't proven it yet? Considering how much more is found out with science, it's down right positive we don't know everything. People used to be totally convinced the earth was flat remember?

[Jeeves]

Kudos to you Ocean Wolf....couldn't have said it better myself. :)

[AleBD]

What is a Kudo? :wacko:

[Warrior Princess]

I thought I'd put a little christian perspective on this:

I'm a christian and I actually dislike celebrating christmas. I feel that christmas has very little to do with Christ and it just stirrs up all kinds of bad feelings in me. does this make me a wimp because I'm a christian who doesn't want to celebrate Christmas? I'd rather celebrate passover or one of the jewish festivals myself.

On the flip side... origins of most of the traditions of christmas are not at all christian. Therefore it's not wimpy at all for a pagan to celebrate christmas or yule as some call it, because they are celebrating traditions that date long before the holiday was ever called christmas and long before it was a commercial holiday.

As for the athiest who celebrates christmas... well they celebrate Santa and tree's and presents and good will and family and scrooge and those kinds of things which are a huge part of what the holiday is TODAY.

So some celebrate what it was, some celebrate what it became and some celebrate what it now is. How is that wimpy? Times change. People change and holidays change.

Sure as a christian I'd rather people celebrated Christmas for Christ, but the truth of the matter is that not everyone is in that same place as me, and who am I or anyone for that matter to judge them or tell them that they shouldn't celebrate that time of year if they wish to? They have thier reasons and I have mine. I can respect thiers and hope that they equally can respect mine. For me... I do it a lot different than most do. No tree, no Santa, few decorations, family get together church and prayer. I don't have to wait for christmas to give my loved ones a present. I get critisized for "ruining it for the kids" but they are loved! they don't need santa and christmas tree's to have fun and feel loved.

ps. I don't think this should be in the "light topics" area at all.

[Ziggy_Encaoua]

As for the athiest who celebrates christmas... well they celebrate Santa and tree's and presents and good will and family and scrooge and those kinds of things which are a huge part of what the holiday is TODAY.

Yes I'd go with that but question Santa being as its based on a mystical character.

[Warrior Princess]

As for the athiest who celebrates christmas... well they celebrate Santa and tree's and presents and good will and family and scrooge and those kinds of things which are a huge part of what the holiday is TODAY.

Yes I'd go with that but question Santa being as its based on a mystical character.

But no one actually believes in that mystical character (except kids who are told otherwise) so therefore are not proclaiming that he is real or making him a god.

Were this the case then no athiest could enjoy science fiction or fantasy or any fictional book, movie or TV show since they are all based on characters that arn't real. Many are based on mysticism and ancient tales. (Star Wars is, a lot of Star Trek is too, then there are movies like Excalibur etc. that are more obviosly based on mysticism)

You made a very good case for argument. I could make an equally good case for why Christians who celebrate christmas are actually engaging in idolatry, Not that I believe that, nor would I ever accuse them of that, I allowe people to just be who they are, but I could make a good case for it, gather a lot of evidence for it and argue it quite effectively! Debate is about effectively gathering facts to proove your case, not really about your case being right or wrong.

There really isn't very much at all about christmas that is about Christ other than the name. it's routes and orgins date back before Jesus came and the whole holiday is not biblical, not preached by Christ, and doesn't even orginate from Christianity itself. In early christianity births of people were not celebrated at all, rather it was thier death that was honored and remembered, thus we have all the days of the martyrs and saints and Holy Communion which is done in rememberance of Christs death, not birth.

The festival of the Sun god was so engrained into the culture that despite a huge swing towards the Christian faith, the general populance did not want to give up this festival, so they adapted it to be about the Son of God rather than the sun god. December 25th being the birthday of Nimrod (also known in egypt as Osiris) who was said to have died and been reborn as an evergreen tree. His wife, also his mother, use to put presents around that tree on his birthday which is the origin of the christmas tree and the origin of christmas. so who was Nimrod? he was one of the sons of Shem who was one of the sons of Noah.

The Holly and the Ivy is based on this festival, decorations, exchange of presents, mistletoe, pretty much everything we do at christmas can be traced to a non christian source. however, as an athiest, i'm sure you would not want to celebrate anything pagan either since it involves faith in gods and goddess's.

However, even though athiesm is a non-prophet organization it still requires a great deal of faith! You still have to believe in something, correct? something that probably requires a lot more faith than I have to believe.

Pw

[Ziggy_Encaoua]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7136682.stm

fucking wuss next Dawkins will be converting

[trinityjlw]

I kinda agree with that one Ziggy...I'm pagan and celebrate yule on the 21st, but not christmas. Everything has become so commercial as well,and people are getting into debt because of it.... x