hummm_mabbe Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Hi all I just wanted to get this out of my system. Nearly 2 years ago, I finally snapped. I saw the nature of my relationship with my mum. And as I tried to put that into words, to tell her why I hurt, why I was so angry, I got all the proof I needed that I was right. Rather than listen, rather than want to understand and try to make a new relationship going forward, it had to be all my fault. I had to be made to feel guilty. I had to think about her feelings and how much she suffers, and how much I make her suffer more. As I got angrier, so she fell back on her oldest way of trying to control me - abandon me. Walk away. Make the fear of being left alone bring me in line and behave. But that time, as angry as I still felt, it also felt like an escape. She would walk away, and I finally wouldnt have to deal with her. I havent missed her, I havent wanted contact with her. In that time, she has sent me a couple of letters. Sometimes they have started off ok, then descended into hate and guilt and demands. This again was another shock - like I was feeling "god - this IS what shes really like". And then other times she would just send me letters about how great her life is. I made clear that the reason I was so angry at her was because she has ignored my emotions for the sake of her own all my life. It was ignored. Today I woke up to just such a letter. It began with a nod to my feelings - my dad told her I was thinking about going back to work, and she was pleased to hear it. Out of a 3 page letter, there was a PARAGRAPH about the very thing that had meant we havent spoken for nearly 2 years. In that paragraph, all she focused on was all she EVER focused on - am I acheiving, do I have a good job. Then she went on about how great it is for her to be a granny, and how happy my sister is, and how happy the whole family is, the various medical ailments my aunties suffer from, what holidays she has been on and how great everyone thinks she is. Do you think she can spell narcissist? The thing is my sarcasm is hiding something much deeper. As I put the letter down it remonded me what the problem has ALWAYS been - that I never felt I belonged, that my family was just this hollow shell, and that mum saw me only in the most one dimensional ways. And here she was telling me how great her life is, how happy all those family members I could never feel close to are. And the reason I could never feel close to them was because of how despicable and shameful I felt, how utterly detached from my own family I felt. Then she finishes with "I know you dont want to speak at the moment and I understand". Does she? Does she really? if she understood, would she not also realise the VOLUMES that need to be said, that she gave the most pathetic lip service to at the beginning of yet another self-serving letter? Whats wrong with her? How can she have her head so deeply buried in the sand? How can she be in such total denial? And really, whats the point in writing ANY of this? Thinking about any of this is like banging my head against a broken glass encrusted granite wall. Utterly pointless and just hurts me more and more. So, Im meant to just not feel? meant to 'just ignore it'? 'Just move on'? Ahhhhhh FUCK. Its like trying to communicate with a fucking photograph. Im not really looking for any advice on how to let go or move on or handle her, i just wanted to get this out. Im sitting here with it all going around and I just needed to put some words down. I just really hope she doesnt write to me again. Ross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrippleAndStarfish Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Heylo Rossie. Not gunna try give any advice or silly fakey-sympathy sh*t, don't worry. Just want you to know that you are heard, my lovely. I hope you feel a little better after getting that out. Sending you biiiig huggles if okay. xxxxxxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villan Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 relate to pretty much everything about not fitting in... being ignored and etc etc i could waffle on more, but i think u could just do with short answers... I UNDERSTAND... You wanna rap this out some more, when yuo ready, let me know... (((((((((Ross))))))))) Love Huggles and Caaaaaaaaake to you Kath xxxxx ps thing with mum is actually bringing me closer to bro... but then he NEEDS me atm, so i am still very sceptical bout it all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pink stars Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 ((((hugs)))) sorry no advice right now but just wanted to let you know I hear you x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Hi guys Thank you for the wordie words, ur right im just needing something, dunno what it is really. Yus chit, I think I just need to chat it out or somethin ... Its just demoralising to realise how much of an effect she still has over me, but then I guess each and every time she does this is just that little bit more evidence that she is living in a world with blinkers on, but meh I guess even that doesnt help. Its just the sheer UNBELIEVABILITY of how she acts. It feels like standing in front of a lion and her saying "oh look, an apple". The feeling of exasperation, of "what...the... FUCK??" .. whats the word - incredulity? And its just got no where to go. I want to scream, punch, smash ... but it would be like every plate or vase I broke would just take me unstoppably back to the same place. Ohhhh GOD I hate this feeling. Its like being slowly strangled and suffocated by a smiling puppet. It feels faintly ridiculous and laughable, yet at the same time I KNOW im having the life sucked out of me. Its like theres no option but to sit here feeling this sensation fill up my guts and my chest. Gah! Ross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villan Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 my mum invalidates me all the time if i am reading and she wants to talk to me she just goes on and on when she is reading and i want to talk to her she snaps "im reading" substitute reading for any other activity btw... she can bang on and on about rubbish for hours AT me, but when i want to talk to her bout summat that matters (to me anyway) her eyes roll and she interrupts and turns it back on her ffs she tells me the smae thing about 4 times... playing the "im old" when i call her on it... and when i say that she has already told me, she doesnt even stop... keeps right on going... if i DARE to stop her with more force she sulks and throw a paddy... theres a load more shit that she does, but i cant go there yet... i go round there every weekend cos it's that or being lonely all weekend in my house isolated on my own... i cut her out of my life for over 3 years when i was married... but when me and Alan split up she found out and i was isolated in yeovil and so i moved back here (15-20 mins away from her)... i dunno how i survive... i guess i just picture her as being ignorant and knowing no better... but that's just cos i can't face it in t just yet... i know you are facing these issues and cant just block it all out like what i do... and that's what scares me most about tackling this, cos then i have to face it, and then i have to actually start to try and tell her how she makes me feel... better atm just shutting those feelings away... protection and survival... how to actually get past this... dunno... dont wanna think about it atm... why have i just typed all of this to you... dunno that either... i kinda lost the point i was gonna try making just after i started on and on... seems a shame to delete it all now though... maybe you can work out what i am saying... if any of it helps you at all... :wacko: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Ross I don't think I need to tell you I understand, I think you know we both been through similar things with our parents/families, so I just wanted to let you know I am here, and if you wanna vent, wanna talk about it, I'm here and I hear you, thinking of you and hoping you can find some resolution and peace in yourself, I can say you don't need her, but we both know that in fact that is exactly what we both need, but unfortunately will never get. love and positive vibes and maybe a little hope being sent your way xxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 LOL chit even though I know it wasnt all meant to be funny, your post made me chuckle at the end about not wanting to delete it all now Yus thats the thing, what really can you do? I dont belive there is a 'thing' you can do, its something that has to change inside, to be able to get to the point, somehow, where her behaviour doesnt affect me so much, and I am free to say "you know what, ive had enough - get out of my face", and not be controlled by the guilt and the feeling of how a child SHOULD behave towards a parent. If the parent doesnt behave how a parent SHOULD behave towards a child, why should the child not respond in kind? I realise this is what my sister always did to her - she was a master invalidator / guilter / sarcasm merchant. It seemed the only way of not being controlled by her, and I think thats my sis ended up not so emotionally damaged - she reacted with hate and anger, and never seemed to feel guilty about it. Ive read a few bookies about this kind of stuff, it does seem like its something that just changes as you change, theres no one thing you can do, be assertive or anything like that. As long as the guilt and need is there, all the assertivenss training in the world is immaterial. I guess its a case of WHAT needs to change inside, and I wish it would damn well hurry up ... I guess part of it is that sense of never having belonged, and of bheing so itterly controlled. realising I have never really shown anyone my true face. Ive just been living her idea of what I was meant to be, if that makes sense ... sigh i dunno. Ross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Ross I don't think I need to tell you I understand, I think you know we both been through similar things with our parents/families, so I just wanted to let you know I am here, and if you wanna vent, wanna talk about it, I'm here and I hear you, thinking of you and hoping you can find some resolution and peace in yourself, I can say you don't need her, but we both know that in fact that is exactly what we both need, but unfortunately will never get. love and positive vibes and maybe a little hope being sent your way xxx Thx Lick, yus its just such a maddening confusing mix of feelings, so hard to sort them out. I think at the root there is a lot of sadness, because I wanted to cry after I had finished reading the letter. I dunno. It was like I refused to let myself though, the anger was stronger. It was like if I got sad, mum would hijack that feeling and say "see? its cos you miss your mummy". NO! Christ this is like trying to shit a cauliflower sized diamond. Ross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 But we don't miss the mum they are, we miss the mum they should have been, there's a big difference! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villan Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 rossy... tis OK to laugh... i was laughing myself at getting to near the end and forgetting why i started!!!! glad i made u smile at least ! maybe my shutting it out is my way of coping, maybe there is nothing to explore... I know nothing will change... I just take the nice things that she does for me... o and there ARE loads of them, believe me... and I appreciate that that is the way she shows her love... that makes all the invalidation bearable... what i guess i have learned to do is NOT feel guilty when i upset her when she invalidates me... that is HERS to deal with, not mine... that was a pivotal point i think... lol @ shit a cauliflower sized diamond... ima get that in a conversation tomorrow... fosure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Hi Lick And its much more than that. Its like everything else that was missing. Hearing about all the family makes me realise was an absolute vacuum things felt, how utterly empty I always felt around them all. Like I wanted a connection so much, but I couldnt. It just brings that total lack of any sense of belogning, and the feeling of loss so much closer to home. I keep almost crying, and then having it taken over by anger, I dunno what wants to come out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 rossy... tis OK to laugh... i was laughing myself at getting to near the end and forgetting why i started!!!! glad i made u smile at least ! maybe my shutting it out is my way of coping, maybe there is nothing to explore... I know nothing will change... I just take the nice things that she does for me... o and there ARE loads of them, believe me... and I appreciate that that is the way she shows her love... that makes all the invalidation bearable... what i guess i have learned to do is NOT feel guilty when i upset her when she invalidates me... that is HERS to deal with, not mine... that was a pivotal point i think... lol @ shit a cauliflower sized diamond... ima get that in a conversation tomorrow... fosure... Hi chit Sounds like you have taken the same thing as with me and felt the opposite about it. For me if she does something 'nice' I cant help but feel like thats meant to make up for the hole, and that I am meant to guiltily concede that everything ive said was a lie, that I never should have got angry. I think thats a key thing for me, having access to that anger without the guilt. Im getting there, mabbe thats why the sadness is getting closer too? Ross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 I feel that too Ross, I really do understand what you mean, but at the same time I feel that if mum or dad had been what they should have been, given validation, love, affection, respect and what ever other things parents are meant to give to their children that I would not have felt that vacuum regarding not feeling part of the bigger extended family, but that in fact that emptiness or vaccum I feel is because I needed something, needed to feel I belonged somewhere, that I had a safety net, a back up plan, but there was nothing, no one, I couldn't even turn to other family members because there was no relationship built with any of them, I was just the spare part. But would that have mattered so much if I had the unconditional love from one or both parents? I know I'm talking about me, but just so as to see if perhaps you feel the same way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villan Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Sounds like you have taken the same thing as with me and felt the opposite about it. For me if she does something 'nice' I cant help but feel like thats meant to make up for the hole, and that I am meant to guiltily concede that everything ive said was a lie, that I never should have got angry. I think thats a key thing for me, having access to that anger without the guilt. Im getting there, mabbe thats why the sadness is getting closer too? oooo... i never took it like that - but then i didnt actually "feel" for a very very long time... maybe if i had have, it would have been different - dunno... hmmm these days it seems like if i ever say "o i like that" when i am round there - she offers to buy one for me... if it is food i have complemented then i usually find it in my weekly "food parcel"... i just write that down to her way of offsettin the way she cant tell me that she loves and cares about me... o and i've stopped saying i like things cos i fear i can abuse it !!!! but i can see how that can be taken in the way that you describe... as guilt... but then i also dont think my mum is manipulative, and from how i interpret what you have written, yours certainly seems to be... i think my mum is just ignorant and that's the way she is and has been brought up... or maybe that's what i have convinced myself about her to survive... dunno really... may have a thinkie... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roses Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 I haven't read all of this and I'm not gonna add lots to it but just wanted to say I know what it feels like when your feelings are invisible to your parent and family. And I wanted to give you a big hug.... ((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((Panda-Hat)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 My mum used to do that chitma, and I felt it was her trying to 'buy me off' so to speak or give herself ammunition later on about how much she's done for me, or to use to tell her friends what a great and wonderful mother she is, like it wasn't genuinely out of any love or concern for me. But you're mum sounds like maybe she does it for a different reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 My mum used to do that chitma, and I felt it was her trying to 'buy me off' so to speak or give herself ammunition later on about how much she's done for me, or to use to tell her friends what a great and wonderful mother she is, like it wasn't genuinely out of any love or concern for me. But you're mum sounds like maybe she does it for a different reason. I relate to this, but from yet another angle. I guess she would buy stuff etc not necessarily with it in mind to control, but then when I was angry at her it would be "look how much I have sacrificed for you, you ungrateful little sod. Ive always tried to give you things, its not my fault your fucking father left me with two kids to bring up. My mother used to be awful to me, you have no idea what its like growing up with that". It would take me from feeling angry, my feelings - to feeling utterly ashamed and guilty and sorry for her. Its hard to see someone who you feel sorry for as a manipulator, you just see them as pathetic. Even though I can see the straight line through, thats how a huge part of me sees her - as the victim I am meant to be good for, protect and be what she needs me to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 I haven't read all of this and I'm not gonna add lots to it but just wanted to say I know what it feels like when your feelings are invisible to your parent and family. And I wanted to give you a big hug.... ((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((Panda-Hat)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) Thank u Roses Mr Cellophane, Im Mr Cellophane .... *waves big white hands* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villan Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 ima share summat i never told anyone... when i was about to get married, my mother actually told me that the last time she and my dad had sex was when i was conceived... i was 30 at the time and my dad had only just died - they were "together" all that time in their marriage that did make me feel really guilty cos i felt at the time, that they stayed together just for me and bro and never really loved eachother and then i felt really angry for her telling me that... why did she do that? apparantly they rowed all the time me and bro were growing up i never remember that i blocked it out my bro told me a few years later imagin being told that too... no wonder ima screwed up!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 I feel that too Ross, I really do understand what you mean, but at the same time I feel that if mum or dad had been what they should have been, given validation, love, affection, respect and what ever other things parents are meant to give to their children that I would not have felt that vacuum regarding not feeling part of the bigger extended family, but that in fact that emptiness or vaccum I feel is because I needed something, needed to feel I belonged somewhere, that I had a safety net, a back up plan, but there was nothing, no one, I couldn't even turn to other family members because there was no relationship built with any of them, I was just the spare part. But would that have mattered so much if I had the unconditional love from one or both parents? I know I'm talking about me, but just so as to see if perhaps you feel the same way? Yes thats exactly how I felt. I guess Im seeing that the sense of feeling 'outside of' people, different, not good enough, the need to hide who I am - it was already present in all my family interactions. I think ur right, and to go a bit further - I think if all that stuff had been there in the family home, the extended family would have seemed much more accessible too. I guess seeing my mum around the family was like hanging out with a friend and seeing them with all of their childhood friends. You just feel like a spare part, as you said. Try to smile, try to be nice and on best behaviour, whilst they are free to be whoever they want to be and have a great time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Ok, I'm feeling very triggered now - this is fucking painful right? But I want to stick with it, and I want to be honest. I want you to understand that I am not like your mother because I have just heard this and boy I feel immense immense undescribable guilt, but something I know I must face and will now change. I hope you will still accept me and be my friend after I tell you, but if I don't share it and I carry on sitting here being your friend and not telling you I will feel like a fake. I have done that to Tiegan, when she wanted to continue a relationship with my mother, I have felt wounded deeply and instead of thinking of Tiegan and finding a way to stick to my decision of keeping her away from my mother out of her best interest at heart, which is perfectly valid, I have felt I needed to defend myself and told Tiegan that she has no idea what my mother is like and then described some of the stuff and how cruel she had been to me, and told her things like if she ever has her own opinion my mum would treat her that way too (which I know to be true) and that her love, which seems unconditional and feels warm and wonderful now, would be the perception that so drastically changes and will hurt her in the future and I've said she has no idea what my childhood is like. I know now that was wrong to do, thank you, I hope we can still be friends, even if you think you need a little time away from me because of this and want to be angry at me that is ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hummm_mabbe Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 ima share summat i never told anyone... when i was about to get married, my mother actually told me that the last time she and my dad had sex was when i was conceived... i was 30 at the time and my dad had only just died - they were "together" all that time in their marriage that did make me feel really guilty cos i felt at the time, that they stayed together just for me and bro and never really loved eachother and then i felt really angry for her telling me that... why did she do that? apparantly they rowed all the time me and bro were growing up i never remember that i blocked it out my bro told me a few years later imagin being told that too... no wonder ima screwed up!!!!!! I dunno what she meant by it, but its clear what it made you feel - and thats whats important. And to my mind, if you already sensed thats what she was doing, it suggests a pattern. If you werent used to her saying things for that effect, why would your first flush feeling be that it was somehow meant to guilt you, or perhaps to just elicit some sort of sympathy? It may be that she had no idea that her seeking sympathy might cause guilt in you - but then thats one of those things, the intricacies of relationships. Parents do things because they feel a certain thing, and to them they MUST do it. At that moment maybe she felt sorry for herself and wanted you to mope with her. But if she had always done that, and especially at times when you were feeling happy, the unspoken message is "when you are feeling good, you make me feel deprived. You need to spare a thought for me right now". She wuldnt even have been aware of it 0 yet the effect would still have been the same. Thats only one way to look at it, only you can feel what the truth of the matetr is ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villan Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 yeah *sigh* and that is why i dont wanna deal wit it !!!!!! hey ho..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roses Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 *Mrs cellophane waves back* Perhaps if I stand sideways they'll see me??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.