lonelyheartemma Posted April 19, 2012 Report Share Posted April 19, 2012 Ive been trying to arrange an appt with a mental health advocate for a while as i'm not happy with the cmht. they seemed very nice and supportive but said the waiting list was 6 weeks. after maybe 2 months i got an email saying i would hear from an advocate very soon. A month after that i finally got a reply. this advocate has actually phoned my social worker to tell her i asked for an advocate. he says she was suprised and i've got to discuss it with her on monday to decide if i still need one., is he allowed to phone my social worker? he did not ask permission and no one said at any point that an advocate might do this of course my social worker was suprised i'd been in contact with an advocate, if i was able to talk to her about things like that i wouldnt need an advocate. I am really really really dreading the appt on monday now. I thought the whole point of getting an advocate was so they could support me through difficult meetings with my social worker, not make meetings even more difficult and not be there to support me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manja. Posted April 19, 2012 Report Share Posted April 19, 2012 Sounds very odd in my opinion. Me no like. I don't think that's right. As for whether they are allowed to do it, I find it unlikely, but don't know for sure xx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bena.baby Posted April 19, 2012 Report Share Posted April 19, 2012 Sounds pretty odd to me. Where did you get this advocate from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelyheartemma Posted April 19, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 19, 2012 thank you Amanda and Esme. I really dont like it either, all they have done for me is make a difficult situation worse I found them online, i think i found the link on the councils website. I emailed to say i didnt like it. I didnt email the advocate direct, i used the main email address. maybe it was a mistake emailing when i was still upset about it but its done now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christine001 Posted April 19, 2012 Report Share Posted April 19, 2012 that is definately bad practice contacting your social worker but I think it is worth seeing her to discuss what you need and how this was not a great start to you needing their help xx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenthing Posted April 19, 2012 Report Share Posted April 19, 2012 (((((hugs))))) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelyheartemma Posted April 19, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 19, 2012 I think i'll tell her the problem wasnt really with her, it was more about not getting a psychologist appt even tho the people who assesed me felt i needed one. The reason why i contacted them was more to do with the other social worker who came with her the first time but shes mentoring my social worker so i dont really want to say bad things about her. I should probably email my social worker, i was going to do this anyway as she hasnt confirmed the monday meeting, i had a suggestion about it and i wanted to tell her i'm doing a college course (she wanted me to get out of the house more and i thought doing a course and learning something would be more interesting and useful than going out for a coffee), i thought i'd say something like this but its very rough and i'll spell check it and stuff before i send it I first contacted advocacy after our first meeting, i wasnt happy with that for a few reasons. you didnt answer my questions about what your job was or explain properly what individual budget meant. there were also a few ocasions where i gave my opinion and got the reply 'you only think that because your depressed'.this made me feel as tho my opinion didnt mean anything. obviously it does mean something and i thought a mh advocate would help me get this across. I also felt like i was being pushed to participate in certain things and i was afraid this pressure would continue until i caved in even tho i felt i had perfectly acceptable reasons for not agreeing to your suggestions. Also i was perhaps wrongly under the impression that we would talk about all the possible options, not just the one or two you'd decided were right for me and i didnt want to agree to anything until i knew all the possible options. The phrase individual budget sounded like i could only have a limited amount of support from the cmht and i wanted to make sure i made the right choices rather than just saying yes to the first few things that were offered. After our 2nd meeting i was happier about how things went between the two of us but i was still very concerned that i had (as far as i was concerned) been on the waiting list to see a psychologist for 7 months so i felt it was worth staying on the advocate waiting list for now, by the time the 6 week waiting list came to an end i thought i would have more idea of if i still needed an advocate. at the moment i feel I probably do as (if youll forgive me) i think i have a far greater need of therapy than i do of a social worker and I think there must have been some error made somewhere as the cpn and drama therapist both agreed with me that i needed a psychologist and probably a cpn, my GP was also very suprised as you know. I think having an advocate to support me will help me deal with the problem of making sure i am being helped in the best way possible. I did not at any point ask or give permission for the advocacy to contact you, i gave them your name only because it was awkward refering to you and (the other people I'd seen) as 'she' all the time, i wanted it to be clear who i was talking about and saying 'my social worker' and 'the other social worker who came to the 1st meeting' is really clumsy! It was easier to use names and also it seemed more official. I was led to believe the normal course of action was for me to wait 6 weeks before being asigned an advocate (actually it was more like 2 months), for me to have a chat to them about my situation and if having an advocate would help and then from there we would discuss things like informing you and what we both needed to do to proceed. But the advocate decided to phone you before even telling me he was my advocate. i'm sorry you had to find out like that, it must have been a bit of a shock. I feel that mistakes have been made by the cmht but you have always been lovely and you have never done anything wrong We can speak about it on Monday if you like but i'm not sure theres anything to talk about. I am not happy with the advocates actions as i expected it to be confidential, as well as completely my decision if i saw an advocate or not. I have emailed to say i am not happy. i would still like the support of an advocate as i'm sure that getting the support i need wont be easy and i hope this doesnt sound bad but i know your only a trainee and it didnt seem right asking you to start questioning everyones decisions, i thought if i had an advocate they could explain to me all the different possible ways of dealing with it. But after what has happened i'm not sure i want this advocacy to support me I dont feel I can trust them to listen to me and look after my needs. I have to say everyone i've spoken to from the advocacy has been lovely before now but contacting you before speaking to his own client really doesnt seem right at all. He had my email address, he knew how to contact me, he chose not to. I'm really worried now that i will get a reputation as going behind everyones backs and manipulating people! but maybe thats good, maybe that will make them think i do need therapy. and i do also think my advocate has gone behind my back so its not just me. also i'm scared now that my social worker will break confidentiality and tell my mum everything i've been doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bena.baby Posted April 19, 2012 Report Share Posted April 19, 2012 It doesn't come off as manipulative AT ALL. It's a really good letter, it explains everything clearly. You are NOT manipulating these people, you are trying to get help. The only part I'd take out is where you say "if you'll forgive me". It's not her place to forgive you, it's her place to do her job. You are her customer, you are the one giving her something to do. Don't let these people feel they can walk all over you. Well done, that must have been hard to write. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelyheartemma Posted April 19, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 19, 2012 thank you Esme. it was hard to write, its also going to be hard sending it. and maybe also hard for her to read it. I think my social worker has mostly done her job well but i think i need things that are outside what any social worker can do. I just dont want her to feel hurt. I think she was asked to take me on as a client because they thought i'd be an easy job, she really thought she and my mum would be working together. instead she's having to deal with me all on her own. maybe i need to make this clearer. tho it is a lie to say shes never done anything wrong. She said i could 'vent' to her when i was upset, so i kind of poured my heart out in an email and she ignored it. she replied to other parts not that part. Its difficult for her as its a problem she shouldnt have to deal with, shes kind of doing the right thing by leaving it. It should really be a therapist or cpn helping with that. But the cmht have decided not to give me any other support and if she doesnt help me no one can. so really I need the advocate to help me contact the people who make the decisions. I would have wanted the advocate to come with me to see my social worker so they can help me get any information i need but really the problem isnt with her, in a way its her problem as much as its my problem because shes been given someone she can't help. thats not what a trainee social worker needs. But if thats how the advocacy operates i'm probably better off doing it on my own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bena.baby Posted April 19, 2012 Report Share Posted April 19, 2012 You know, honestly, I think if she feels "hurt" that's her business and her problem. When you're doing a professional job, it's not your place to feel hurt by your clients. If a student says something to me, like they are bored in class, or they aren't learning anything, I don't really take it that personally. I just try to think of ways to change the situation. Anyway, that's not really important, you don't want to hurt her feelings and that's great, because it shows you care. But in my opinion, people in a professional capacity really have no right to feel hurt. I just don't like seeing you tying yourself up in knots worrying so much about other people. If she's been given a case that's too hard for her to deal with, then maybe she needs to let her manager know or reconsider her career or get some support. You are ill. Try to worry less about her and more about you. Have you ever asked if you can see a different social worker? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addy2 Posted April 19, 2012 Report Share Posted April 19, 2012 Hi, Emma i started a training course yesterday to become an advocate its peer to peer advocacy where its people with mental health issues supporting others with mental health, to we were told that advocates are client led and you do what the client asks of you in terms of support so no i don't think they should have phoned your social worker that was another thing we were told advocates don't talk with cpns or social workers or cares without the clients permission and even then its the client who is being supported. I hope it goes ok for you.xx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelyheartemma Posted April 19, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 19, 2012 maybe a different social worker would feel more able to fight the cmht's decisions but tbh she has done more than any other social worker i've met. There might be social workers who have more confidence with this sort of thing or are more likely to be listened to because they are more experienced but that doesnt mean they'll be willing to try. My social workers mentor was very inflexible and dissmissive of anything i said. idk I would be scared of getting someone worse and if i need more support than social workers can give it will be difficult to find any social worker who can support me properly. I suppose i do care about my social worker, i really dont want her to be upset or have a difficult experience with a client when shes not fully qualified. But a part of it is me being scared of getting into trouble. I hope she'll read the email before i see her on monday but maybe i'll print everything out just in case, she doesnt always remember to check her email. thank you Addy, thats really helpful to know that. and its great your doing a course, i'm sure you'll be really great at it, you are always really supportive on here. Its a really good idea to have people supporting each other, this site shows how helpful it can be. I hope it goes really well for you xxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelyheartemma Posted April 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 I emailed the advocacy and my social worker, no reply from either. my social worker probably wont reply, shes seeing me on monday anyway and when i've sent her an email before she hasnt seen ittill i've told her its there. the advocacy, not sure what to think about them. Still really shocked my advocate my social worker and told me i was there client esp before he told me i was his client. shocked also that my advocate seems to be taking her word over mine, saying he will close my case unless me and my social worker agree we need an advocate. so what happens if i tell him yes and she tells him no? idk why im shocked, no one takes my word for anything. my opinion doesnt count. why should an advocate be any different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toaster Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 pretty sure this would be a breach of confidentiality kinda sucks when you are trying to complain using an advocacy service then you have to complain about them am sorry this has gone this way for you I know you are somewhere in Wales, do you have 'Hafal' in your area? xx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelyheartemma Posted April 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 thank you Toast. Hafal does sound really good, tho so did the advocacy i'm with. I'll give them a few more days to respond. to be fair i have had contact with the guy who seems to be in charge and two or three duty advocates and they've all been really kind and supportive. so if they agree the advocate did do something wrong i will try to arrange a meeting with them and see how it is when i meet them in person. I'd rather not start again with a new organisation unless i really have to as i'd have to explaih everything again and probably go on another waiting list which might be longer. I checked the website, it says they are confidential. if they want to do something they will always speak to the client about it first. It also says how to make complaints against them, one of the options is emailing like i did. still very scared about seeing my social worker tho. I dont think i've done anything wrong but she might not feel the same way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autism-bpd Posted April 21, 2012 Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 as far as im aware yes because someone has to agree to agree to the self refer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelyheartemma Posted April 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 that doesnt really sound fair Flipper but if this is true they need to make this clearer. if you have a problem with someone and a 3rd party tells them about it thats not likely to improve things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autism-bpd Posted April 21, 2012 Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 they had to with me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doormouse Posted April 21, 2012 Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 Advocates via MIND might be another option - I was very briefly involved with them - within a week got a call from the head of mental health services asking why I wasn't happy and apologising! Wasn't exactly what I needed at the time tbh, but I wasn't very clear about what I did need then, so can't hold them responsible! http://www.mind.org.uk/help/rights_and_legislation/mind_guide_to_advocacy I found this a pretty helpful page, and includes a list of questions to ask - some about confidentiality there. Mousex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autism-bpd Posted April 21, 2012 Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 mouse a while ago i couldnt get a mental health advocate because not on the mental health team , it strange but ended up with my disability advocate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelyheartemma Posted April 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2012 thank you mouse. I'll think about mind tho i havent found them helpful in the past. But they might have different people there now and the advocates might be ok I think i'm under the mental health team but idk if social workers count :/ but i would take a disability advocate, i think pds are disabilities arent they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autism-bpd Posted April 22, 2012 Report Share Posted April 22, 2012 the disability advocate meaning learning disability Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b0bulat0r Posted April 23, 2012 Report Share Posted April 23, 2012 I contacted Bedford advocacy and explained my situation to them I was given an advocate in Four DAYS. I asked for him to be present at my GP's appt and then again at my psychiatrists appointment, but they asked my permission for things all the time and he always asked if I wanted his involvement or not, Seems very out of line and weird to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelyheartemma Posted April 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2012 I spoke to my social worker today, she was ok about the fact i'd spoken to an advocate. I thought she probably would be but in principal i think speaking to people like that without the clients permission is not a good idea. I would like to say social workers, cpns etc are always understanding but they are human like us and sometimes issues can arise. even if the support worker turns out to be fine about it, knowing they know what youve been doing and waiting to here their reaction could cause a lot of anxiety. But my social worker seemed to think it was completely fine and normal, she says its always' good to keep the lines of communication open' and if i didnt want them contacting her i should have said so what part of the word confidentlality and 'we only act with the clients permission' do i not understand? I want to move to Bedford Rob! much better advocacy and i'd be living near you! My social worker thinks being refered to a psychologist shouldnt be a problem so i probably wont need an advocate to fight my corner there. only problem is i've been refered to a lady i've met before, last time we met i left her very distressed and walked in front of a bus. if I am seeing her regularly i think i should have an advocate present as i dont want to be alone with her. also i'll only have a social worker till the end of july as her placement ends then. I'm not sure how i feel about this. I dont really want a social worker but it seems like its something she should have explained at the first meeting and it makes me wonder what else i havent been told. I dont think my social worker meant to keep things from me (except maybe in the 1st meeting when her mentor was in charge) but she genuinely believed we'd met before so there are probably things she tells every new client which she didnt tell me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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